What's your opinion of Jason Campbell?

riggo

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khiladi;2298413 said:
Arizona isn't that great offensively either. They put up 31 against Miami and 23 against SF. They only put up 35, because the Jets were up by over 30 going into the second half. Warner threw fifty times that game for +400 yards.

Uh... Dallas has beaten Green Bay and the Eagles and they totally shut-down Cleveland. The Commanders haven't shut-down anybody, other than the Cowboys, and even then, they didn't shut them down. The Cowboys refused to run the ball making themselves one dimensional. They played like crap and still almost had the onside kick and most likely would have went down the field and scored.

some points and corrections-

its already been brought up, but i'll reiterate- the cards are #5 in O. the skins have played the #'s 2-5 offenses actually. they have not played an O currently ranked below 5th in the league. the skins D isnt shutting anyone out, but they are keeping the leaugues best O's to about 10 pts a game less than they average. that is impressive.

cleveland is #32 in O. this is 2008, not 2007.

the skins have played the most difficule schedule in the NFL this year. they are 3-1, having just beaten the leagues consensus #1 team at their place. their only loss is to the current consensus #1 team, the super bowl champion giants at NY.

The Redsskins were down twice in the fourth quarter against horrible defensive teams that totally choked the games away.


to my recollection, the skins were down in the 4th to
two teams- the giants, and NO. they were not trailing the cards or the boys.

as for campbell, he is currently the #1 rated Qb in the east. #2 in the NFC, #4 in the NFL. he has yet to throw a pick. not bad for a guy getting ready to start his fifth game in yet another new system.

i'd say he definitely does not suck. ;)
 

KLJ

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riggo;2302327 said:
i'd say he definitely does not suck. ;)

no, he doesn't suck.. he is doing what is asked of him and he hasn't turned the ball over..

i'd say he has worked his way to the top 15 spots in the nfl
(please don't bring up qb rating to dispute my opinion)
 

KLJ

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riggo;2302340 said:
i'm curious- why?
i just didn't want to go down that road.. according to qb rating, romo is the greatest qb in the history of the league.

i was simply trying to say that before the season started i pegged campbell as one of the worst starters in the league. as of right now, i would put him right in the middle. (which is a huge jump)
 

Hostile

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L-O-Jete;2301879 said:
He looked like a franchise QB, what would you be willing to pay for one?
Not to me he doesn't. He is certainly a starter, but I have a higher definition of a Franchise QB than one good game against my team.

Was Clint Longley a franchise QB? Kevin Sweeney? Jason Garrett?

All of them had better games than Campbell did last week. It's about body of work, not one game. It's about overall ability to make other teams sweat.
 

Bob Sacamano

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Sonny#9;2301699 said:
More sour grapes...if Jason Campbell sucks, and he just picked apart your "All-Pro" Secondary...what does that say?

Psst -- saying Campbell "sucks" shows just how much of a blind, ignorant homer you really are. Keep 'em coming.

you act like that's some kind of feat

we allow everyone to pass all over us in the stupid hope that a NFL QB is going to throw into coverage

noone except for the Giants has been able to make Campbell hold onto the ball, which is has made him a bad QB for most of his career, not saying he's going to go back to being bad, but he's going to go through some struggles if teams can cover your receivers, either by better talent, which you haven't seen against Arizona or New Orleans, or by a better scheme, which you didn't see from us
 

DaBoys4Life

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Extreme;2301794 said:
This was where I quit reading in this thread. You try so hard to keep hammering the point home, but it doesn't matter. The argument could be made that EVERY great player was a product of the system.

Emmitt smith had one of the best O-lines in NFL history when he was in Dallas, raking up yards. When the O-line got depleted, his stats suffered tremendously, he was traded to Arizona, and he did nothing measurable the rest of his career.

That being said, If you say Campbell is a product of the system, and not a good QB, can you at least admit the same for Emmitt Smith?

**sarcasm alert**He wasn't a good back. He was a product of a good line. His stats back it up 100%.

Now do you see how absurd youre argument is? Campbell is not a product of the system. Zorn isn't what you would call "known worldwide for his offensive expertise." That argument doesn't hold up.

Have you thought for a minute that Campbell's earlier play being lackluster was the result of shoddy coaching? Think about it. No QB does good in a run first offense.

So how many hall of famers did emmitt smith run behind???
 

Extreme

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Hostile;2302555 said:
Not to me he doesn't. He is certainly a starter, but I have a higher definition of a Franchise QB than one good game against my team.

Was Clint Longley a franchise QB? Kevin Sweeney? Jason Garrett?

All of them had better games than Campbell did last week. It's about body of work, not one game. It's about overall ability to make other teams sweat.
I agree with you 100% on this. If we went with the common perception, along the lines of what you just said, Todd Collins and Vinny Testaverde (although waaaaay past useful age IMO), would both be franchise QB's.

The thing I do like about Campbell, is I no longer freak out and cuss him out when he throws deep or starts to run. Last year, those were automatic turnover situations. The thing I'm liking, is that he is really starting to show that he has made significant progress since last season in his development.

The way I see things, is even a good season or two doesn't define a franchise QB. I mean, even Gus Frerotte had two solid seasons, and we see where that went lol.

Romo is in the same boat I think though. We haven't seen him work without some of the best in the game, so it's hard to gauge so far. He does look pretty damn good doing what he does so far though. He just needs the big game confidence. Once he gets that down, I think you guys would be damn hard to beat.

Cambell has the advantage that he's young, and he's physically a perfect design of a QB as far as his genetics go. He just needs to prove still that he's solid, and not just having a good few games.

But, keep in mind fellas, even the greats, and the franchise QBs had crap or mediocre seasons/games mixed in.

Examples.....
Marino 1999 - 2448yds, 12td, 17int
Elway 1983 - 1663yds, 7td, 14int
Aikman 1989 - 1749yds, 9td, 18int
2000 - 1632yds, 7td, 14int

Aikman is widely considered one of the great QBs. Not only as a Commanders fan, but as a stat *****, I think it's lame and he's slightly above average, not great (outside of his postseason record).

His career average season looks like this.....

2,745 Yds
13 Td
12 Int

Does that seem like a franshise QB? That's what he was.

Jason Campbell in his short time, has stats that average out to this for a season.....

3,250 Yds
19 Td
11 Int

Kinda makes his future a little brighter doesn't it? That puts him up there near Romo, and ahead of Aikman.

I still say it's too early though. If he finished with 5k yards, 50 td, 0 int, then came out next year and averaged less than 100 yards a game, and threw 5 td and 30 int, he would suck. He needs more than a year or two under his belt, as does Romo, before people can jump to conclusions and assume.
 

Extreme

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DaBoys4Life;2302621 said:
So how many hall of famers did emmitt smith run behind???
I have no idea, and I'm too lazy and care too little to look it up. Besides, waiting as long as they did to put Monk in proved to me that the HOF is garbage. Stabler isn't in and should be. A lot of greats are. Using the HOF to gauge greatness is like someone arguing that Elvis and the Beatles sucked because they never won a Grammy. (I personally hate them both btw ;) so it's not bias)
 

Bob Sacamano

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Extreme;2302640 said:
I have no idea, and I'm too lazy and care too little to look it up. Besides, waiting as long as they did to put Monk in proved to me that the HOF is garbage. Stabler isn't in and should be. A lot of greats are. Using the HOF to gauge greatness is like someone arguing that Elvis and the Beatles sucked because they never won a Grammy. (I personally hate them both btw ;) so it's not bias)

1

well, he's not in yet, but Larry Allen
 

Hostile

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Extreme;2302636 said:
I agree with you 100% on this. If we went with the common perception, along the lines of what you just said, Todd Collins and Vinny Testaverde (although waaaaay past useful age IMO), would both be franchise QB's.

The thing I do like about Campbell, is I no longer freak out and cuss him out when he throws deep or starts to run. Last year, those were automatic turnover situations. The thing I'm liking, is that he is really starting to show that he has made significant progress since last season in his development.

The way I see things, is even a good season or two doesn't define a franchise QB. I mean, even Gus Frerotte had two solid seasons, and we see where that went lol.

Romo is in the same boat I think though. We haven't seen him work without some of the best in the game, so it's hard to gauge so far. He does look pretty damn good doing what he does so far though. He just needs the big game confidence. Once he gets that down, I think you guys would be damn hard to beat.
I think Romo is closer to the franchise label right now than Campbell is. I don't put it on him yet. So why would I put the same label on Campbell? Exactly, I wouldn't.

We appear to have struck gold in Romo. I couldn't be happier about that.

Cambell has the advantage that he's young, and he's physically a perfect design of a QB as far as his genetics go. He just needs to prove still that he's solid, and not just having a good few games.
His best advantage is the WCO. When you got Zorn as the OC, later the HC, I said that would either make him or break him. It appears he is adapting to it nicely.

But, keep in mind fellas, even the greats, and the franchise QBs had crap or mediocre seasons/games mixed in.

Examples.....
Marino 1999 - 2448yds, 12td, 17int
Elway 1983 - 1663yds, 7td, 14int
Aikman 1989 - 1749yds, 9td, 18int
2000 - 1632yds, 7td, 14int

Aikman is widely considered one of the great QBs. Not only as a Commanders fan, but as a stat *****, I think it's lame and he's slightly above average, not great (outside of his postseason record).

His career average season looks like this.....

2,745 Yds
13 Td
12 Int

Does that seem like a franshise QB? That's what he was.
Aikman was a franchise QB because he won, his Offenses piled up huge yardage and points. In the clutch he was a killer. Romo's par tof the way there, but he has to win when it is clutch time and not just one game.

Jason Campbell in his short time, has stats that average out to this for a season.....

3,250 Yds
19 Td
11 Int

Kinda makes his future a little brighter doesn't it? That puts him up there near Romo, and ahead of Aikman.
No, it doesn't. He still has to win the critical games like Aikman did. That is what sets him apart. With Aikman's accuracy if you put him in a WCO and let him throw he would have put up huge stats. That wasn't his scheme in Dallas.

I still say it's too early though. If he finished with 5k yards, 50 td, 0 int, then came out next year and averaged less than 100 yards a game, and threw 5 td and 30 int, he would suck. He needs more than a year or two under his belt, as does Romo, before people can jump to conclusions and assume.
That I agree with.
 

khiladi

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Hahahaha...but I thought Boldin and Fitz were going to shred us? What happened? Your posts just keep getting funnier and funnier...

When did I say that? Did they shred the Jets, depsite having Fitzgeral and Boldin? Arizona has been a medicore team since who knows when, with both Fitzgerald and Boldin. They have never been contenders. Now all of the sudden they are an impressive team. To blow up your team, you got to blow up the Arizona Cardinals... Pathetic...

I didn't say they sucked...I just said the only team they shut down was the worst offense in the league.

Sure, you were just pointing out they shut down in the worst offense in the league for the sake of it. Please... You just got caught, because now, according to your original argument, the Redskisn win doesn't look to impressive. You do realize that Cleveand WRs were open plenty of times and and Braylon Edwards dropped passes against our defense. Plus, Derreck Anderson was throwing lame ducks all over the field.

More sour grapes...if Jason Campbell sucks, and he just picked apart your "All-Pro" Secondary...what does that say?

It says our schemes suck... I've been saying it all along, you just having been paying attention. Jason Campbell had his 'best game' last year against the Cowboys as well, throwing well over 300 yards. Dallas plays in a way that gives up the underneath, with their CBs playing 15 yards off the receiver, hoping the QB makes a mistake. Last year, Campbell did, this year he didn't. Dallas gave Campbell those numbers... You think I'm gonna be impressed because Campbell had these types of games against DSallas... Hell, even Kitna did decent against us last year because of our passive scheme.

When Campbell gets pressed like he did against the Giants, he is horrible. He has a slow release and is slow-footed. He throws plenty of interceptions. ANd you know it, that is why your hyping him up now... If it was standard Jason Campbell to not throw INTs and suck, you wouldn't be trying to hype him up on this board...

Psst -- saying Campbell "sucks" shows just how much of a blind, ignorant homer you really are. Keep 'em coming.

No, Jason Campbell does suck... What is it now, his 4th year. Even Harrington strung together a couple of good games. Gus Frerotte as well. Trent Green... Heath Schuler... Like I said, If it was standard Jason Campbell to not throw INTs and suck, you wouldn't be trying to hype him up on this board...
 

khiladi

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Sonny#9;2301770 said:
...and so have the Cowboys. That doesn't have anything to do with anything this year.

If it doesn't mean anything, than why you trying to throw the 'greatness' of Jason Campbell in our face... If it doesn't mean anything in terms of proving something regarding the Commanders as a whole, it surely doesn't mean anything in proving how 'good' Jason Campbell is...

We Dallas fans know that December is key... BTW, we are nowhere near the Commanders in terms of starting off 3-1 and failing to make the play-offs over the past ten years... That has been a consistent staple of your team...
 

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khiladi;2302913 said:
We Dallas fans know that December is key... BTW, we are nowhere near the Commanders in terms of starting off 3-1 and failing to make the play-offs over the past ten years... That has been a consistent staple of your team...
Consistent staple of OUR team in the last 10 years?

When did you win your last post season game?

Exactly.

It does no good to make it, then leave as quick as you got there.

Oh, and you have lost your last 6 post season games, and only made it one time more than we did in the last decade. Your veil is thin buddy, very thin.

2-3 will always be better than 0-6 ;)

And speaking of closing it out in December.....do you just make things up in your head and present them as fact? In the last 10 years, Dallas in 16-26 in December. Washington is 23-20. In 1998 we won 3 in Dec., we did 5-0 in 2005, and 4-1 last year. In that same stretch, Dallas has not won more than 2 games in December. In 2002, you threw a goose egg 0-4.

This is why I love when people try to argue bogus points, because stats never lie.
 

NIBGoldenchild

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khiladi;2302897 said:
If it was standard Jason Campbell to not throw INTs and suck, you wouldn't be trying to hype him up on this board...

Campbell has only thrown 2 or more INT/game in 16% of his games. Tom Brady, widely considered as the best QB in the league, has done so in 18% of his games. Is Campbell INT prone? No, he is not. And you can't prove it. Man, I love facts. They blow up the most ridiculous arguments.
 

Sonny#9

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khiladi;2302897 said:
When did I say that? Did they shred the Jets, depsite having Fitzgeral and Boldin? Arizona has been a medicore team since who knows when, with both Fitzgerald and Boldin. They have never been contenders. Now all of the sudden they are an impressive team. To blow up your team, you got to blow up the Arizona Cardinals... Pathetic...



Sure, you were just pointing out they shut down in the worst offense in the league for the sake of it. Please... You just got caught, because now, according to your original argument, the Redskisn win doesn't look to impressive. You do realize that Cleveand WRs were open plenty of times and and Braylon Edwards dropped passes against our defense. Plus, Derreck Anderson was throwing lame ducks all over the field.



It says our schemes suck... I've been saying it all along, you just having been paying attention. Jason Campbell had his 'best game' last year against the Cowboys as well, throwing well over 300 yards. Dallas plays in a way that gives up the underneath, with their CBs playing 15 yards off the receiver, hoping the QB makes a mistake. Last year, Campbell did, this year he didn't. Dallas gave Campbell those numbers... You think I'm gonna be impressed because Campbell had these types of games against DSallas... Hell, even Kitna did decent against us last year because of our passive scheme.

When Campbell gets pressed like he did against the Giants, he is horrible. He has a slow release and is slow-footed. He throws plenty of interceptions. ANd you know it, that is why your hyping him up now... If it was standard Jason Campbell to not throw INTs and suck, you wouldn't be trying to hype him up on this board...



No, Jason Campbell does suck... What is it now, his 4th year. Even Harrington strung together a couple of good games. Gus Frerotte as well. Trent Green... Heath Schuler... Like I said, If it was standard Jason Campbell to not throw INTs and suck, you wouldn't be trying to hype him up on this board...


I just wanted to quote this bit of drivel for fun. Especially the part about Trent Green. Trent Green has had a hell of a career...

I can just feel the bitterness seething off this post. It's great.
 

Sonny#9

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khiladi;2302913 said:
If it doesn't mean anything, than why you trying to throw the 'greatness' of Jason Campbell in our face... If it doesn't mean anything in terms of proving something regarding the Commanders as a whole, it surely doesn't mean anything in proving how 'good' Jason Campbell is...

We Dallas fans know that December is key... BTW, we are nowhere near the Commanders in terms of starting off 3-1 and failing to make the play-offs over the past ten years... That has been a consistent staple of your team...

That's funny considering the Cowboys average record the last 10 years in december and january is something like 2-3.
 

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Sonny#9;2302975 said:
That's funny considering the Cowboys average record the last 10 years in december and january is something like 2-3.
16-26 in december. Not even 2-3 :D This guy's like a Pack fan claiming they play great in the heat.
 

Bob Sacamano

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Extreme;2303007 said:
16-26 in december. Not even 2-3 :D This guy's like a Pack fan claiming they play great in the heat.

just 1 question

how long are you going to commemorate the Commanders beating Dallas w/ your sig?

JMO but it's kind of lame
 
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