Who's it going to be, Towns or Okafor at #1?

[ABQCOWBOY]

Lakers' fans are scapegoating Kobe but the reality is no one wants to play on that roster for that team.
Outside D12 who said, hey, whats the timeline for Kobe and the plan post Kobe, I am not sure Kobe is much of an issue.
The issue now is there is no talent to work with.

Lakers fans believe they'll add pieces the same way they thought they were gonna land LeBron and Carmelo.
It is called delusion.

They can overpay some third tier star like Dallas did with Parsons but they aren't getting any of the trans-formative guys and they don't have anything in place.
Clarkson, Randle and Love is a lottery team. Love sees that and that's why he'll be in Cleveland. Durant isn't looking at LA.

Deandre Jordan and LaMarcus Aldridge are looking at Texas teams.

LAL has very little appeal right now and that won't change with just Kobe leaving.

I don't think it has anything to do with Laker Fans. In fact, most of them don't believe that players do not want to play with Kobe. I am not sure what it is but I would pretty much guarantee that it's not a Lakers Fan perception thing.

This entire line of thought is very reminiscent of opinions I heard back in the mid 90s. Nobody want's to come to L.A. but then, they signed Shaq and traded for Kobe. I don't think L.A. has suddenly become the worst possible destination in the NBA. I think there is a reason but I think it has to do with things other then being the Lakers. I agree that LA. does not have a lot of talent on their roster now but that's a self fulfilling argument. You don't have talent so you can't get talent. I think the Lakers will be able to bring in some talent and I also think they will draft some talent. I think they already have pretty decent young players in Randle and Clarkson. If they can add a nice big man, that's a pretty good nucleus to start with. I'm more optimistic then you perhaps.

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

Ummm. maybe.
But only if the Lakers had planned for that and not traded for him in the first place or traded him off themselves.

When he left it signaled a rebuilding but they refused and played out the string burning resources.
Seriously, as of this second the Lakers are the the bottom five franchises for resources or talent.
It's a lot like the Post Campo Cowboys. And it requires a major upheaval.

You don't just flip a switch and turn that around.
D12 was a nasty shot because he basically gave up money and the glamour of the Lakers to go to Houston who hadn't won big since the Dream left.

because he was scared to be challenged. Dewie is not a one, or franchise player... and he has not been the same since Orl championship run..
my opinion... I'm not a fan...

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

I agree, he has said consistently that he will be returning but, the issue IMO is what James thinks of Love and how big a role James wants him to have. It's pretty widely reported that Love is not part of that "inner circle" and as a result, he's pretty much destined to be a guy who sets picks and rebounds. That's really not Love and I can't see him happy in that for any length of time. This is not to say that Love will not return to Cleveland but for that to happen, I think he has to see himself as a bigger part of the offense or he's gone.

I kind of think that changed with his injury... i think guys reached out, and he felt the love (pun intended).. he has been quick to use the same terminology that kyrie has "my brothers"...
and he said LBJ is the best player in the post season.. not steph.... I think they are good.... but lets see what happen with tristen, and what kind of suitors come for love...Cavs gotta make a business decision...
It would be in the Cavs interest to sign both imo.... the cap is going up... and they don't have space to make any other investments... so go over the cap, keep what you have. Winning will more than pay for the tax hit they will have for tristen, bron, love, & kyrie.....

(edit: I would have run with tristen, and kept wiggins at the top of the season... but they had to adhere to the "Lebron Offense"... Iso, spread)

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

I don't think it has anything to do with Laker Fans. In fact, most of them don't believe that players do not want to play with Kobe. I am not sure what it is but I would pretty much guarantee that it's not a Lakers Fan perception thing.

This entire line of thought is very reminiscent of opinions I heard back in the mid 90s. Nobody want's to come to L.A. but then, they signed Shaq and traded for Kobe. I don't think L.A. has suddenly become the worst possible destination in the NBA. I think there is a reason but I think it has to do with things other then being the Lakers. I agree that LA. does not have a lot of talent on their roster now but that's a self fulfilling argument. You don't have talent so you can't get talent. I think the Lakers will be able to bring in some talent and I also think they will draft some talent. I think they already have pretty decent young players in Randle and Clarkson. If they can add a nice big man, that's a pretty good nucleus to start with. I'm more optimistic then you perhaps.

as long as they stay out of the top 3 next year... (go sixers!!! )

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I kind of think that changed with his injury... i think guys reached out, and he felt the love (pun intended).. he has been quick to use the same terminology that kyrie has "my brothers"...
and he said LBJ is the best player in the post season.. not steph.... I think they are good.... but lets see what happen with tristen, and what kind of suitors come for love...Cavs gotta make a business decision...
It would be in the Cavs interest to sign both imo.... the cap is going up... and they don't have space to make any other investments... so go over the cap, keep what you have. Winning will more than pay for the tax hit they will have for tristen, bron, love, & kyrie.....

(edit: I would have run with tristen, and kept wiggins at the top of the season... but they had to adhere to the "Lebron Offense"... Iso, spread)

That's going to be a problem I think. Three max contracts, which is what I believe it might take, to keep them all is going to be tough but they can do it with Bird Rights for Love but I don't know if they can do that and keep Tristan Thompson. The question then becomes, which do you want more? Thompson is not the offensive player that Love is but he's a guy who is very efficient from the field, plays excellent defense and rebounds the basketball well. Do you need that kind of contribution more then you need another scorer? Going to be interesting to see what the Cavs do here.

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

That's going to be a problem I think. Three max contracts, which is what I believe it might take, to keep them all is going to be tough but they can do it with Bird Rights for Love but I don't know if they can do that and keep Tristan Thompson. The question then becomes, which do you want more? Thompson is not the offensive player that Love is but he's a guy who is very efficient from the field, plays excellent defense and rebounds the basketball well. Do you need that kind of contribution more then you need another scorer? Going to be interesting to see what the Cavs do here.

If they're willing to cap out.. and pay big tax (which will decrease after the cba, but still be big)... they can keep em all..
but you may be right... they may decide to go the route of one man must go..... their offseason will be interesting.

edit (they have TT bird rights as well)

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

If they're willing to cap out.. and pay big tax (which will decrease after the cba, but still be big)... they can keep em all..
but you may be right... they may decide to go the route of one man must go..... their offseason will be interesting.

edit (they have TT bird rights as well)

If they lose, then I think they might decide that one man must go. With Irving and James salaries locked in, the question of who gets touches becomes a bit of a problem. For Love to truly be effective IMO, the Offense needs to run through him. He needs to get touches and a significant amount of them. Irving is only going to get better and that means more shots. James is who he is and I don't see him not being the focal point of the Offense so how then does Love get the kind of Offensive involvement he needs to be able to be the kind of player that is worthy of a Max Contract for the Cavs? I suspect that what will happen is that he will again be unhappy in his role and it will eventually cause problems. Never mind that you also have Shumpert, JR and Delly to resign as well. Timo is not an immediate FA but he's going to be one the following year and then what do you do there? He's not going to play for 4 million a season on his next contract. If they lose, then that likely means that they probably think about bringing in more talent to help strengthen the team for the next season. I don't know enough about Clevelands financial situation so I can't say if they can afford to exceed the Tax line or not.

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

If they lose, then I think they might decide that one man must go. With Irving and James salaries locked in, the question of who gets touches becomes a bit of a problem. For Love to truly be effective IMO, the Offense needs to run through him. He needs to get touches and a significant amount of them. Irving is only going to get better and that means more shots. James is who he is and I don't see him not being the focal point of the Offense so how then does Love get the kind of Offensive involvement he needs to be able to be the kind of player that is worthy of a Max Contract for the Cavs? I suspect that what will happen is that he will again be unhappy in his role and it will eventually cause problems. Never mind that you also have Shumpert, JR and Delly to resign as well. Timo is not an immediate FA but he's going to be one the following year and then what do you do there? He's not going to play for 4 million a season on his next contract. If they lose, then that likely means that they probably think about bringing in more talent to help strengthen the team for the next season. I don't know enough about Clevelands financial situation so I can't say if they can afford to exceed the Tax line or not.

Heck, winning may make them decide one man must go more than losing.... because they would have won with TT, not love...

But I think everything we've mentioned is in play....

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Heck, winning may make them decide one man must go more than losing.... because they would have won with TT, not love...

But I think everything we've mentioned is in play....

That's possible too. Either way, and I know that both sides have said that Love is staying, I am not so sure. If you look at it from the perspective of a public relations standpoint, neither side can really say anything else. If Love said he's out of Cleveland no matter what right now, his life is hell. If the owner says that, it's a distraction at the worst possible time. I would not be surprised at all to find that neither party is singing the same tune after the championships.

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

That's possible too. Either way, and I know that both sides have said that Love is staying, I am not so sure. If you look at it from the perspective of a public relations standpoint, neither side can really say anything else. If Love said he's out of Cleveland no matter what right now, his life is hell. If the owner says that, it's a distraction at the worst possible time. I would not be surprised at all to find that neither party is singing the same tune after the championships.

possibly

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I think the best thing Cleveland could do is to trade Love to Philly for their three 2016 1st round picks.

;-)

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

I think the best thing Cleveland could do is to trade Love to Philly for their three 2016 1st round picks.

;-)

Ha!!!lol

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

Okafor on D - "That is a criticism but we won a national championship at Duke. Coach K was fine with how I played defense."

And this is why I draft Towns

 

[jterrell]

because he was scared to be challenged. Dewie is not a one, or franchise player... and he has not been the same since Orl championship run..
my opinion... I'm not a fan...

I'm not a fan of D12 either but it is hard to argue with his decision to leave in retrospect.
(Of course I think he should have joined the Mavs but leaving seems clearly prescient)
Had he stayed they'd have struggled to build anything given the cap limitations and Kobe was a shell of his former self yet still wanting 30 shots per game.
The Lakers still do not appear to have a post-Kobe plan which means D12 would have finished his career playing for 7-8 seeds at best and lottery at the worst.

Houston was a 2 seed this year after some injuries. LAL is picking at the very top of the draft.

 

[jterrell]

I think the best thing Cleveland could do is to trade Love to Philly for their three 2016 1st round picks.

;-)

If Love wanted to leave I think CLE would cooperate. Obviously not for draft picks but for proven veteran bench help.
Just no way I see Love wanting to leave. Winning is hard to duplicate and his salary in Ohio is worth a heck of a lot more than his salary in LA.

CLE will have another 2-4 tremendous value guys lining up to play with LeBron again this off-season.
And they'll likely be prohibitive favorites entering next year. ---tho GSW a year from now may be significantly better just via experience.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

If Love wanted to leave I think CLE would cooperate. Obviously not for draft picks but for proven veteran bench help.
Just no way I see Love wanting to leave. Winning is hard to duplicate and his salary in Ohio is worth a heck of a lot more than his salary in LA.

CLE will have another 2-4 tremendous value guys lining up to play with LeBron again this off-season.
And they'll likely be prohibitive favorites entering next year. ---tho GSW a year from now may be significantly better just via experience.

I don't know how much the contract value of being in Cleveland plays into this. I mean, obviously if they offer a Max Contract, then it might be better to be in Cleveland but you don't really know if they will do that or not. I think that it's a good chance they may not. Not saying they won't, but I think L.A. is the only team that will offer him a Max deal. See what happens.

I do agree though, GS will get better, just by playing Cleveland in the Championship. They are a lot more talented then Cleveland is, IMO. They are losing this series right now because they don't understand how to beat Cleveland. They are perfectly capable of doing it but they don't have enough experience yet and it's hurting them. They may figure it out or maybe not. Have to wait and see. All I know is, James and the rest of the Cavs should be on the brink of sweep right now and they aren't.

 

[jterrell]

I don't know how much the contract value of being in Cleveland plays into this. I mean, obviously if they offer a Max Contract, then it might be better to be in Cleveland but you don't really know if they will do that or not. I think that it's a good chance they may not. Not saying they won't, but I think L.A. is the only team that will offer him a Max deal. See what happens.

I do agree though, GS will get better, just by playing Cleveland in the Championship. They are a lot more talented then Cleveland is, IMO. They are losing this series right now because they don't understand how to beat Cleveland. They are perfectly capable of doing it but they don't have enough experience yet and it's hurting them. They may figure it out or maybe not. Have to wait and see. All I know is, James and the rest of the Cavs should be on the brink of sweep right now and they aren't.

IF Love opts out he'll get the max.
Like Dallas did with Parsons you pay now what will be his going rate next year.
With the cap going up a max deal now will be a bargain soon.

TBH, LAL even being interested in Love makes no sense.
It's all fan talk and really dated thinking.
Love can't get them out of the Lottery and their only real asset is a scoring 4.
They aren't one all-star away from anything.
And if anything they want to keep powder dry for the following season.
The Lakers biggest problem now is not being honest with themselves and making a real plan.
Dream scenarios seldom work.

As to the series, GSW is the team barely escaping a sweep thus far.
They are literally one shot away from being down 0-3 and playing game 4 on the road.
The emotional toll of losing Kyrie in game 1 probably saved that 1 for GSW.

I thought GSW would win in 7 and they may still be able to get there if they grow up, play really hard and utilize the FAR deeper bench.
But it isn't going to be easy having lost home court.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

IF Love opts out he'll get the max.
Like Dallas did with Parsons you pay now what will be his going rate next year.
With the cap going up a max deal now will be a bargain soon.

TBH, LAL even being interested in Love makes no sense.
It's all fan talk and really dated thinking.
Love can't get them out of the Lottery and their only real asset is a scoring 4.
They aren't one all-star away from anything.
And if anything they want to keep powder dry for the following season.
The Lakers biggest problem now is not being honest with themselves and making a real plan.
Dream scenarios seldom work.

As to the series, GSW is the team barely escaping a sweep thus far.
They are literally one shot away from being down 0-3 and playing game 4 on the road.
The emotional toll of losing Kyrie in game 1 probably saved that 1 for GSW.

I thought GSW would win in 7 and they may still be able to get there if they grow up, play really hard and utilize the FAR deeper bench.
But it isn't going to be easy having lost home court.

I am not so sure that is accurate JT. What L.A. sees with Love is the idea of bringing in a scorer at Center and opening up options for them at 2. Right now, they may be forced to take Okafor and I have heard rumors that, while publicly, they don't see that much space between Okafor and Towns, Kupchak may not believe that. In fact, He may like one of the Guards better or he may like the idea of trading that pick for a nice Vet or future considerations. They really don't have any picks in 2017 and historically, while the Lakers have never really built through the draft much, I think they are considering that more strongly. Their lack of recent success in bringing a franchise player to L.A. might be making them reconsider how they do business. I agree that Love doesn't solve all the problems but it does give them a post player who can score and rebound. As you say, it could be a good financial decision for them. I think they have a plan.

GS should be winning this series. They are more talented and they can play an up tempo game and basically run waves of guys at Cleveland but they have to be smarter. They have to make better decisions and take care of the ball. This series could be 3-0 either way IMO. They could have won last night if they had played smarter IMO. I agree, they need to grow up fast.

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

Lakers NBA mock draft: Lakers 'locked in' on selecting Jahlil Okafor with No. 2 pick ?
http://www.silverscreenandroll.com/2015/6/10/8760079/la-lakers-jahlil-okafor-mock-draft

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Lakers NBA mock draft: Lakers 'locked in' on selecting Jahlil Okafor with No. 2 pick ?
http://www.silverscreenandroll.com/2015/6/10/8760079/la-lakers-jahlil-okafor-mock-draft

One thing about Okafor to L.A. If he goes there, that's probably the one franchise that would commit to using him as a true back to the basket, post center. I think they would commit to running the offense through him. JMO