Williams Overrated, counterpoint

[MichaelWinicki]

which is basically the point I was trying to make. They're different players. Both are good at what they do. One does one thing better than the other. IMO, Reed is not "head and shoulders" better than RW based on numbers.

You know it's time to turn out the lights when you get the...


"They're different players" defense.

 

[superpunk]

Where are the missed tackle numbers or TD passes given up?

You can say with certainty that Reed would have less in either category?

 

[MichaelWinicki]

How many Defensive Player of the Year Awards has each won?

Reed 1
RW 0

That's a pretty big statement there.

But they're different players...

What in "different players" don't you understand fella?

 

[MichaelWinicki]

You can say with certainty that Reed would have less in either category?

You're right I can't say that at all... but I would believe that those numbers are telling.

 

[superpunk]

But they're different players...

What in "different players" don't you understand fella?

Tiki Barber and Larry Johnson both play RB.

Would you make snide remarks if someone called them different players?

 

[superpunk]

You're right I can't say that at all... but I would believe that those numbers are telling.

But you have absolutely no way of knowing if that is the case.

 

[BlueStar22]

Tiki Barber and Larry Johnson both play RB.

Would you make snide remarks if someone called them different players?

Nah, he'd probably counter with they wear the same pads and cleats and both take handoffs from the quarterback, and line up in the backfield.

 

[superpunk]

I'm also still waiting for the answer to the question that never gets answered.

List all these TDs and big plays Roy has given up. List some of these missed tackles.

Beyond Shockey's TD last year and missed tackles on Chris Brown and Tony Gonzales, I have no idea where this ridiculous perception that Roy is a TD-allowing, tackle missing machine comes from. Please, enlighten us all with the apparent laundry list of missed tackles and TDs allowed that Roy has been responsible for.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Tiki Barber and Larry Johnson both play RB.

Would you make snide remarks if someone called them different players?

Listen Mr.... I could wake up in the middle of the night, with a full bladder, accidently drop my glasses behind my nightstand and crank out a snide remark.

All in a day's work pal.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I'm also still waiting for the answer to the question that never gets answered.

List all these TDs and big plays Roy has given up. List some of these missed tackles.

Beyond Shockey's TD last year and missed tackles on Chris Brown and Tony Gonzales, I have no idea where this ridiculous perception that Roy is a TD-allowing, tackle missing machine comes from. Please, enlighten us all with the apparent laundry list of missed tackles and TDs allowed that Roy has been responsible for.

You act hurt. Seriously.

 

[superpunk]

Listen Mr.... I could wake up in the middle of the night, with a full bladder, accidently drop my glasses behind my nightstand and crank out a snide remark.

All in a day's work pal.

I know that. :

I just don't think it's unreasonable to say that Reed and Williams are different players, even though they play the same position - and I don't think anyone should be mocked for saying so. Do we knock Westbrook as a RB because he doesn't get the same amount of carries as Tiki, or Portis? Scheme, the way a player is used, all goes into making an honest evaluation of a player. Or do we all believe Hines Ward is the 20th best receiver in football?

 

[superpunk]

You act hurt. Seriously.

That's just indigestion

I think, if it is going to be claimed that Roy is some choke artist, some blithering fool who couldn't cover Marcus Spears, or tackle a piece of wood, those doing the claiming should at least have some form of proof. Specific examples, if you will.

Crazy me....thinking people should back what they say up. :starspin

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I know that. :

I just don't think it's unreasonable to say that Reed and Williams are different players, even though they play the same position - and I don't think anyone should be mocked for saying so. Do we knock Westbrook as a RB because he doesn't get the same amount of carries as Tiki, or Portis? Scheme, the way a player is used, all goes into making an honest evaluation of a player. Or do we all believe Hines Ward is the 20th best receiver in football?

LOL!


Hey I agree with you. Reed and Williams go about their "work" in different manners. You're 100% right.

But there is no doubt in my mind that Reed is the better player. I think he maybe the best SS to play over the last decade at least. Roy is a very good player. He just isn't Ed Reed. I don't think there is a thing wrong with that. Their has to be a #1 and Reed is it. Roy is up there but he's not #1. His lack of progress from his rookie season hurts him in my eyes.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

That's just indigestion

I think, if it is going to be claimed that Roy is some choke artist, some blithering fool who couldn't cover Marcus Spears, or tackle a piece of wood, those doing the claiming should at least have some form of proof. Specific examples, if you will.

Crazy me....thinking people should back what they say up. :starspin

I firmly believe that if you asked football fans outside of those of the Cowboys or Ravens who was the better safety, Ed Reed or Roy Williams, that it wouldn't be close.

 

[superpunk]

Hey I agree with you. Reed and Williams go about their "work" in different manners. You're 100% right.

100%?

Damn....now I wish I had actually said that.

But there is no doubt in my mind that Reed is the better player. I think he maybe the best SS to play over the last decade at least. Roy is a very good player. He just isn't Ed Reed. I don't think there is a thing wrong with that. Their has to be a #1 and Reed is it. Roy is up there but he's not #1. His lack of progress from his rookie season hurts him in my eyes.

Like you say - Roy is up there. I already agreed that Reed is #1. Roy is somewhere next in the area with Polamalu and Dawkins. Reed has a nose for that INT that noone else does. No shame in that. Reed can lay the wood, but not like Roy - there's no shame in that either. Both have areas of their game that they are better in.

I just don't see where the talk of Roy being incapable in coverage, and a shoddy tackler comes from. The evidence isn't there.

 

[superpunk]

I firmly believe that if you asked football fans outside of those of the Cowboys or Ravens who was the better safety, Ed Reed or Roy Williams, that it wouldn't be close.

I firmly believe that in the message you quoted, I didn't say a single thing about Ed Reed.

So, I firmly believe that you are going insane.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

So, I firmly believe that you are going insane.

Like you think you're the first to say that!

 

[Hostile]

Oh sure!

Burmashave has turned you against me!

If I had the capacity to hate...

Hold the phone on that exit from the flock.

I may be back. Tell me about love Bagwam.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Tell me about love Bagwam.

Well see my son, when a man and a woman meet and each develops a "funny feeling for the other" they soon...


Oops!


Where are the overheads?!

 

[TheEnigma]

This looks to be the correct place for this question. For some reason, I can't seem to remember if it was last year or the year before that Roy had the a buscuit away from a linebacker thing going on. Maybe it was both years. Anyways, would someone enlighten me?