Young outruns the field, is top offensive rookie

[superpunk]

I challenge anyone to go back and look at Vince Young in HS, Vince Young in College, and Vince Young in the pros. Then find a difference between what you see. Some people just have it. He's special and I will go on record as saying so. He's a man playing among boys as far as I am concerned. Vick is nowhere near his league nor has he ever been anywhere close.

Actually, Vick's first year starting was FAR superior to what Young put together. And he just won, too.

 

[rcaldw]

With all you wrote, then rcaldw, I'm sure you can see why people who aren't as enamoured with Vince Young are very skeptical. There is no precedent for a player like he is - currently - having extended success. Running QBs may have a brief 2-3 year run of domination, but once those hits pile up, if they haven't taken the time to perfect the mental aspect, they just go to junk - and fast.

I do understand the skepticism. But I also know that people were skeptical that he could ever play this year. Then people were skeptical that he could win this year. Now he is the rookie of the year. (offensive)

Who would have ever dreamed of the ending to the Titans-Texans game? I know its just one game, but what it demonstrates is Young's uncanny ability to rise to an occasion. (Just like the Rose Bowl) I mean, he literally stuck his finger in the eye of the Houston Texans.

And you know what else I love about the guy? There he is on the Titans bench after their loss this last week, and he is inconsolable. The great ones HATE losing. That is Vince Young. He HAS to win. That is what Norm Chow said about him. The talent is great, but it is his heart, his will to win that is most impressive, and his ability to win over his teammates.

Sooner or later a player will come along that will change the way the QB position is viewed. I'm not saying he will change the way that EVERYONE plays QB. I'm saying that he will be so unique that he plays the position in a way that others haven't, yet he is still a winner. I think Vince Young could be that guy.

 

[rcaldw]

It should be Mike Vick, not Mike Vicks. There is only one. He is the only QB out there who is a running QB. There are others that have some mobility and good running skills, but they are passers first. Vick is the only who really isn't a passer first. I exclude Young at this point because he is only a rookie. I will give him a couple of more years to see if he develops into a passer first QB.

I haven't really seen many other Mike Vick type QB come into the NFL. There have been other good athletes come into the league, but not like him. And certainly none that don't develop their passing game, but still remain somewhat of a threat at the QB position.

Bobby Douglass of the Bears was a runner first and a passer 2nd, and he was the guy that Vick JUST NOW passed on the QB single season rushing list. That record took a long time to break. So Douglass was pretty good at that in his own right.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I have been a strong proponant of Vince Young for some time. I am not a fan of running QBs, myself. However, I do not believe that is what Young is or will be. You can not teach what Young has. As time goes on, I believe his passing skills will develope. I believe he will evolve into more of a Warren Moon then a Michael Vick. Nobody can say for sure what the finished product will be but that is my opinion of Young.

 

[joseephuss]

Actually, Vick's first year starting was FAR superior to what Young put together. And he just won, too.

That came with a year under his belt and a couple of starts his rookie season. A good comparison will be to see what Young does next season compared to other second year QBs. I agree with Aikman and many others when they say it takes 3 to 4 years for a QB to really get it. Many said it would take Young that long and I agreed with them. Still do. It will take him that long to get it. He is showing he can be successful now without getting it. If he does indeed get it, he could be very dangerous. If anybody makes sense of what I typed, you are not drunk enough or maybe too drunk.

 

[rcaldw]

Actually, Vick's first year starting was FAR superior to what Young put together. And he just won, too.

Michael Vick's first year, 2001 season:

50-113, 44.2 completion %, 785 yards, 2 TD's 3 int's
29 rushes 300 yards 1 TD
Falcons record 7-9

 

[theogt]

Michael Vick's first year, 2001 season:

50-113, 44.2 completion %, 785 yards, 2 TD's 3 int's
29 rushes 300 yards 1 TD
Falcons record 7-9

He started 2 games that year. Yes, that is technically "his first year starting," but obvious it's not what SP meant.

 

[rcaldw]

He started 2 games that year. Yes, that is technically "his first year starting," but obvious it's not what SP meant.

That was his rookie year, wasn't it?

Do we get to count this as Romo's rookie year? He never threw an NFL pass until this year.

 

[joseephuss]

Bobby Douglass of the Bears was a runner first and a passer 2nd, and he was the guy that Vick JUST NOW passed on the QB single season rushing list. That record took a long time to break. So Douglass was pretty good at that in his own right.

That was in a different era of the NFL. It really was a different game back then. Joe Namath led the league in passing yardage that same 1972 season with 2816 yards. Today clearly is more of a passing league.

It also shows that Vick is really alone in the running QB category. He is the rarity, so it is easy to see why running QBs don't win Superbowls. There are hardly any that have come around. The ones that do aren't really running QBs as much as they are young QBs that are developing their games. Once they develop, they run less. Randall Cunningham is an example. Vick is the exception.

 

[theogt]

That was his rookie year, wasn't it?

Do we get to count this as Romo's rookie year? He never threw an NFL pass until this year.

What's your point?

You replied with stats trying to prove SP wrong. You misread his statement. I pointed this out.

 

[rcaldw]

That was in a different era of the NFL. It really was a different game back then. Joe Namath led the league in passing yardage that same 1972 season with 2816 yards. Today clearly is more of a passing league.

It also shows that Vick is really alone in the running QB category. He is the rarity, so it is easy to see why running QBs don't win Superbowls. There are hardly any that have come around. The ones that do aren't really running QBs as much as they are young QBs that are developing their games. Once they develop, they run less. Randall Cunningham is an example. Vick is the exception.

I'm not arguing that Vick isn't unique. I'm just saying he wasn't the first guy who ever played in the league who was run first pass second. And no matter WHAT era he played in, Bobby Douglass was as unique to his era (in terms of a guy who's effectiveness was mostly by the run) as Vick is to his.

I would also add that it isn't as if Vick doesn't throw too. He threw the ball 388 times this year. Granted, not as much as most of the starters, but not all that far behind either. He ran the ball 123 times.

 

[The30YardSlant]

Here's a fun little game: Let's list all the NFL QBs with a lower completion % than Vince Young






























































































Awesome stuff

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Actually, Vick's first year starting was FAR superior to what Young put together. And he just won, too.

I have to seriously question the validity of this statement.

Here are Vicks Rookie Season numbers:

G 8, Att 113, Comp 50, Comp% 44.2, Yds 785, YPA 6.95. TDs 2, INTs 3, QTRT 62.7

Rush Att 31, Yds 289, Avg. 9.3, TDs 1. Fumbles 6.

Here are Youngs Rookie Season numbers:

G 15, ATT 357, Comp 184, Comp% 51.5, Yds 2199, YPA 6.16, TDs 12, INTs 13, QBRT 66.7.

Rush Att 83, Yds 552, Avg. 6.7, TDs 7, Fumbles 12.

From these numbers, I don't know how one can draw the conclusion that Vick had a better Rookie season then did Young.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Here's a fun little game: Let's list all the NFL QBs with a lower completion % than Vince Young


































































































Awesome stuff

Reggie McNea........... oh wait, he don't play QB no more does he?

 

[rcaldw]

What's your point?

You replied with stats trying to prove SP wrong. You misread his statement. I pointed this out.

Did Michael Vick start in the year 2001? Is that his first year starting a game?

Vick threw 113 passes. He played in 8 games. I would think that this would be significant experience compared to what Young had under his belt when he became "starter".

How did Vick do with HIS first experience? Those are the stats I posted. Seemed pretty applicable to the discussion to me.

 

[The30YardSlant]

Reggie McNea........... oh wait, he don't play QB no more does he?

List NFL QBs with a lower completion % than Vince Young

 

[rcaldw]

Here's a fun little game: Let's list all the NFL QBs with a lower completion % than Vince Young





























































































Awesome stuff

Lets play another game. List all of the NFL QB's with a better winning pct in the games that they started?

Awesome stuff.

 

[joseephuss]

Here's a fun little game: Let's list all the NFL QBs with a lower completion % than Vince Young



Awesome stuff

Now list all the QBs with higher winning percentages this season. Pretty awesome for a rookie on a team that went 4-12 the season before.

 

[Rampage]

colsten was robbed

 

[rcaldw]

I like Heavy, in fact we have teamed up together on a couple of subjects, but all you have to see to know where he is coming from on Vince Young is to look at that Aggie planting the Longhorn into the turf.