4 teams including champs had "high interest" in Hitchens

[TheMarathonContinues]

I don't think it's the same rant. Nobody thought that FredBeard would not start. Most simply thought that either we took him too early or that we didn't get enough in trade or both.

This player, it seems that most believe he is not a starter but rather, a backup. That, at least to me, is a bit different.

People thought Fred would start by default lol. He had no one to beat out. They are very similar. Except one we invested a 1st rounder in and the other is a 4th rounder.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Then you over estimate the talent we have on this team. When a guy can come off the couch and immediately start, then I would expect a draft pick, even a late one, to be able to challenge for that position. And our DL is a wreck. I most certainly expect someone to immediately come in an earn some snaps. It's the reason why so many are all over Ben Gardner's jock.

People like to pigeonhole him into a backup but I think that is garbage. He made a lot of tackles and played a lot of snaps for one of the best defenses in the country. The team clearly values him and projects him into a starting role in the future.

You guys are trying to define him by this characterization but I am not so quick to proclaim that say Quarles would be more likely to start over McClain than Hitchens is to over Carter, Wilber or whoever. Your premise assumes the conclusion: Hitchens is a talentless hack.

And I have no idea why people are gushing over Gardener. I don't see him starting unless a whole lot of guys get hurt. That is delusional.

 

[jobberone]

I dont see the 2 comparisons as close. First, I always tend to favor a trade down more than a tradeup. I liked the Fred pick, but Im sure I wasnt ecstatc when it came out that whole Floyd debacle. I loved the Martin pick but am highly critical that Jerry comes out and says JFB was #1 on the board. He would have been better served to jusst answer like Belichek -"We drafted the player we drafted "(10 times)

I wasn't talking about the player but the reaction from some of the fans. SSDD.

While Fred was a draft down then trade up the situation was similar in both filled needs and both were allegedly drafted too soon. Martin was considered by many to be the safest pick in the entire draft. He had no questions about his character yada and ability. WYSIWYG with him. Fred was not ranked as highly as Martin but they are a lot alike. They can do the job, not rock the boat, and have great intangibles. I love 'em.

And why be upset over what Jerry says? He's been running his mouth since he got here saying look at me. You can get a lot out of Jerry if you listen carefully. Other times it's best to overlook him. This is one of them. He's not running the show despite some's favorite battle cry. That should be evident from the picks of recent.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Nowehere near the same scenario, but since you don't have an example to the original question.....

Fred was product of a trade down that potentially nabbed a #2 receiver as well in the 3rd. So yes The Fred + Williams was a good move and value. And the fact there was war room issues with Floyd and rankings, etc (well-documented) didn't change the ending talent win, but showed continued issues that always seems to come to light in this organization

Nowhere near? You asked me to name someone who met those standards. The meltdown here after Mayock said he had him as a third rounder was legendary. When people started posting game film and talking about his power and intelligence, or how the UW weight program went for maxxing out over reps or showed other draftniks that had him rated higher they were roundly dismissed as koolaid drinkers being koolaid drinkers. Jerry Jones was being Jerry Jones and that was that.

I watched a whole bunch of his games and came and said that he was hugely powerful and compared him to Warmack who I do not think is powerful at all and was absolutely vilified for it.

Point is that all of the shenanigans that goes on around here has no bearing on whether or not a player will be successful. They will be whatever they will be regardless.

 

[jobberone]

I don't think it's the same rant. Nobody thought that FredBeard would not start. Most simply thought that either we took him too early or that we didn't get enough in trade or both.

This player, it seems that most believe he is not a starter but rather, a backup. That, at least to me, is a bit different. Of course, I think you also have to factor in the fact that it's a 4th round pick and not 1st round so that's a big difference in favor of the pick as well.

I'm talking about the woe is us, the FO sucks, yada yada rant. SSDD. It doesn't matter what the topic is for many.

 

[Plankton]

And why be upset over what Jerry says? He's been running his mouth since he got here saying look at me. You can get a lot out of Jerry if you listen carefully. Other times it's best to overlook him. This is one of them. He's not running the show despite some's favorite battle cry. That should be evident from the picks of recent.

I disagree with your views on Jones. He's so desperate to make it seem like he's a football guy that he runs his mouth and says too much. The best football guys, such as Newsome, Thompson and Belichick say very little. It's like Parcells said - I am in the information gathering business, not the information dispensing business.

And, for someone not running the show, as you say, he's remarkably involved. I watched the war room camera a lot over the course of the draft, and Jones was at the position board quite a bit leading discussions. I didn't see McClay, Stephen Jones or Garrett doing this. Jones was the fulcrum.

As he has been being that he has "final say."

 

[Nightman]

I don't see the "Bad Body" or "chubby" complaints. I see a MLB body, biggest complaint about Lee is he seems a little lite in the rear for MLB. He ran a 4.6 and was a tackling machine on a squad full of quality LBers. I'll give him a few practices before I make my life-long determination about him.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I disagree with your views on Jones. He's so desperate to make it seem like he's a football guy that he runs his mouth and says too much. The best football guys, such as Newsome, Thompson and Belichick say very little. It's like Parcells said - I am in the information gathering business, not the information dispensing business.

And, for someone not running the show, as you say, he's remarkably involved. I watched the war room camera a lot over the course of the draft, and Jones was at the position board quite a bit leading discussions. I didn't see McClay, Stephen Jones or Garrett doing this. Jones was the fulcrum.

As he has been being that he has "final say."

I don't think there is ever any question that Jones works to build consensus. I see it more as him choosing who gets to make the decision moreso than it is him making the decision itself.

 

[iceberg]

I'll give Risen props... he like a few others did think highly of the Romo signing and said pretty much from the get-go that the kid had some potential... He wasn't proclaiming a string of 4,000 yards seasons but early on he thought the kid had some ability.

Like throwing gas on a fire.

 

[ConstantReboot]

What little I saw on tape was mixed for me. He's no different than the overwhelmingly vast majority of mid round picks are. They need to be developed.

For me the first thing I look at in a LB is instinct. He has that. Then I look at production. We can't see intangibles for ourselves but we can listen to others and look at awards, is he a captain and/or team leader. Do his teammates like him? Then I look at the measureables. Mostly size and his ten and cones. I look at his burst off the edge. This guy has all that except not certain about his burst. It's very difficult to teach instincts.

Gotta agree with you here. Instincts is a top trait of linebacker. People forget that Sean Lee doesn't have measureables such as top speed and good size either. But he seems to know where the ball is going to be before it gets there. People put too much into 40 time speed. But I think that 3 cone time and other measures are just as important.

All of the defensive players that we selected seem to have pretty good instincts. Including Bishop.

 

[btcutter]

Knowing Seattle, SF, Arizona, and St Louis did doesn't make you reconsider?

Unless those team actually come out say that Dallas jumped them and stole him.....then rest is just rumors to me.
He's gonna have to prove it on the field!

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I don't see the "Bad Body" or "chubby" complaints. I see a MLB body, biggest complaint about Lee is he seems a little lite in the rear for MLB. He ran a 4.6 and was a tackling machine on a squad full of quality LBers. I'll give him a few practices before I make my life-long determination about him.

From what I understand, he went through the process of losing weight after the season. At the combine he still had some jiggle around his torso and midsection and you can see it around his neck and face in that picture.

As someone pointed out before, Lee plays at 235. The scheme is designed that a DT forces a double team so that OG are not getting onto the second level. Quickness is what is at the premium.

 

[AsthmaField]

What I feel like a lot on here is missing is that I think the team really wanted to add some toughness to the defense. I think they wanted to add some players that were hard nosed, tough, hard hitting players, and that they set out in this draft to find some.

You can argue a lot of things about Hitchens, his draft ranking and where he should have been taken... but what nobody can argue is that this is one tough guy who plays hard, hits hard, and brings a level of intensity to the game. And that, as much as anything, is what I think Dallas was drafting.

On a team that is known for producing tough guys, Hitchens stood out as the toughest. When Dallas made their call to him, Marinelli and others specifically mentioned his toughness and Iowa's reputation for toughness. Everything you read about the guy talks about how hard he hits and how tough he is.

I mean, maybe I'm off here... but I truly think they liked him in large part because of what he brings, toughness wise, to the defense. I think the team valued him greater than most because they are specifically targeting guys who have those traits now... which is something I've been wanting them to do for a long time now. Personally, I couldn't be happier to see them getting guys like Hitchens and Dixon.

So, while he might have been a 5th or 6th rounder to say, Miami - maybe teams that covet toughness and attitude like San Francisco, Seattle, Arizona, and now Dallas, thought the guy was worth a 4th.

Just my line of thinking.

 

[Tawney88]

It looks to me like they drafted a backup. I think it speaks to their growing discomfort with Lee's health issues. That's fine, maybe even necessary, but this team isn't good enough to be targeting backups in the 4th round ... they just aren't.

Drafting backups isn't smart when you have as many holes as Dallas. I hated that pick.

 

[Irvin88_4life]

Fair point, but proclaiming he will be a starter or contributor for many years is the same vein. The exasperation, though, is NEVER with the player its with the FO and position some of these players are taken in. Had Hitchens been a 7th rounder or UDFA, there would be no threads on him.

Also, there is no one left at VR who had anything to do with selecting, finding, grooming Tony Romo. I think that is a stretch comparison

Jerry Jones, Stephen Jones say hello

 

[iceberg]

I don't buy this for a second. Of those teams, only the Seahawks took a LB after the fourth round and that was Kevin Pierre-Louis of Boston College, who most "experts" had ranked higher than Hitchens.

None of the other teams took a LB after the fourth round. So were they really even looking for a LB, or is Hitchens such an unbelievably talented hidden gem that he was the only LB they were interested in taking?

I guess, since the Seahawks did take an OLB, I can believe they had an interest, but I have absolutely no reason to believe this Birddog guy would have any insight into what is going on in their war room, along with the war room of three other NFL teams.

Maybe the guys they wanted were gone? Our DT was gone so we should take the next DT?

 

[Nightman]

From what I understand, he went through the process of losing weight after the season. At the combine he still had some jiggle around his torso and midsection and you can see it around his neck and face in that picture.

As someone pointed out before, Lee plays at 235. The scheme is designed that a DT forces a double team so that OG are not getting onto the second level. Quickness is what is at the premium.

I saw ray Lewis fluctuate up and down throughout his career, sometimes carrying more bulk, sometimes cutting weight for more speed. He was boxy as well, but I think you need that as a LB as long as you have some quicks and instincts. The D is designed to let the MLB roam, but it doesn't usually work out that way. Hayden never created the doubles last year and our LBers had to take on OGs all day. I like a guy with a little junk in the trunk that can maintain against the OL.

 

[LatinMind]

He's a MLB or SAM. He's not better then Carter in space.

This is why i say dont pay too much attention to these so called experts with sites. Listen to what the teams tell you. They drop hints here and there. But learn to what they look for in players. Alot of us wanted Skov late but he doesnt fit with what they want to do. He didnt fit for alot of teams apparently. Alot of fans get too wrapped up in their wants for the team, or the big sexy name thats been all over the news. Its clear this team is looking at guys that fit a certain mold.

* Is productive in college. Big tackle numbers, stats
* Speed, speed and more speed
* Quick off the snap
* Guys who arent affraid to put in the work.

 

[Rockytop6]

This tweet is from a scout that corresponds with the crew over at BTB. This is from a conversation immediately following the pick and the guy straight up says that the seachickens were ready to pick him. Spagnola has been on the radio saying other teams were interested but this guy comes out and names them He also says that he clocked him at 4.61 when he worked him out recently for what that is worth.

We all know the argument against him. Narwocki, NFP and draftdigest all rank him around the same spot of not in the top 150 and within two spots of 33 in the position. Therefor it must be a reach.

To me either one of two things is possible. Either Spagnola and BTB are lying to us or the defending champs, the 9ers and two other clubs ranked him similarly to what we did.

So how do you reconcile this information, Zoners?

TB

I don't think Spag and BTB are lying! I still am not excited about the pick however!

 

[xwalker]

People like to pigeonhole him into a backup but I think that is garbage. He made a lot of tackles and played a lot of snaps for one of the best defenses in the country. The team clearly values him and projects him into a starting role in the future.

You guys are trying to define him by this characterization but I am not so quick to proclaim that say Quarles would be more likely to start over McClain than Hitchens is to over Carter, Wilber or whoever. Your premise assumes the conclusion: Hitchens is a talentless hack.

And I have no idea why people are gushing over Gardener. I don't see him starting unless a whole lot of guys get hurt. That is delusional.

Yes, I'm more excited about the Hitchens pick than Gardner.