CFZ Do we actually have fans who believe Dak is Elite?

[Diehardblues]

I think that's where this whole discussion goes. I can make a argument for Dak being top 5 this year. I can make one for Geno Smith. Jared Goff is quietly having an efficient season.
It seems like draft status gives a lot of these guys a boost in these discussions.....Specifically in the Justin Herbet discussion. He has not had an elite career. Back peddled into the playoffs for the first time. But he has an arm and is 6'6 so he's "elite" lol.

Part of analysis is measuring potential. Surely everyone can see the potential Herbert has with the God given ability and proto type skill sets . Now whether they turns into total team success is yet to be seen .

 

[starfan1]

I’ve been going to bat for him in recent years against the Dak Haks but in another thread been arguing with a fan I actually agree on many issues but he believes Prescott has become Elite and in Top 5 of QB’s in the league.

He even asked me what 5 QB’s are better. Which was an easy response. Prescott is arguably by most sound analysts and critics closer to a Top 10 QB, not Top 5. Which being in the next best group isn’t a bad place to be .

The argument stemmed from a basis narrative of his that Elite QB’s were a necessity to being a consistent contender in Cap era. Which is another argument within itself . There are exceptions to that rule as well. But the argument initiated with criticism of franchises with less playoff success this era. We actually agree to a point on that basis.

And then he said Dak has become Elite. Even saying that he had bashed him earlier in his career. Are there other fans who also believe he has become Elite? I thought besides the extremes on both sides of the Haks and Homers that most felt he was closer to Top 10 to above average . Enough to build around and hopefully have more success.

Like most franchises except for a handful who have an Elite QB, you have to build around average to above average QB’s. No shame in that . Anyway, curious where the vibe is at this time . Not interested in hearing from the extremes. Thanks

Honestly don’t understand you at times. You go on this crusade earlier to call out the haters then make a thread that is ripe for trolling from those you call out

 

[RonnieT24]

Dak is top 10. Thats more than good enough to win or get to the SB. Elite is an overused term and its dumb. Was Tony Eason Elite? Was Flacco Elite? Dilfer? Steve Mcnair wasn't elite. Matt Ryan? Nope. Matt Stafford is not Elite, yet he won a SB. Russ Wilson even on his best day wasn't Elite. But he didn't need to be all the time. He did what was asked. Same with Dak. He is in his prime.Dak has 2-3 more years of prime ball left. The time is now.

Whoa there hoss.. I can't go there with you. Russ absolutely had days when he was absolutely elite. There was a time when he was the best combination of passer/runner in the game. Don't get bamboozled by how bad he played last year after breaking that bone in his throwing hand or what he's showing in that mess in Denver. I think in 2020 he started out 16 TD to 2 INTs in the first four games while averaging well over 300 yards and completing over 75% of his passes. He was the main reason a team with a 20 something ranked defense and a leading rusher who went for 682 yards was able to go 12-4.

As for the 2-3 more prime years left for Dak? I disagree.. Unless he suffers some serious injury he should be able to play at a high level until at least age 35-36. I mean Romo's best years came after his 33rd birthday. Why do we expect Dak to fall off at age 31? That's not generally how it goes with QBs.

 

[Zman5]

Fans who only watches one team play believe in the myth that "elite" QBs play mistake free and never throw bad passes. Rodgers is one of the best QB to ever play. And as you can see, he only throws perfect passes.

 

[Arkyvarminter]

I'd put him around the middle of the pack as far as QB's go. Is he good enough to win it all? I don't think so........

 

[Rayman70]

Whoa there hoss.. I can't go there with you. Russ absolutely had days when he was absolutely elite. There was a time when he was the best combination of passer/runner in the game. Don't get bamboozled by how bad he played last year after breaking that bone in his throwing hand or what he's showing in that mess in Denver. I think in 2020 he started out 16 TD to 2 INTs in the first four games while averaging well over 300 yards and completing over 75% of his passes. He was the main reason a team with a 20 something ranked defense and a leading rusher who went for 682 yards was able to go 12-4.

As for the 2-3 more prime years left for Dak? I disagree.. Unless he suffers some serious injury he should be able to play at a high level until at least age 35-36. I mean Romo's best years came after his 33rd birthday. Why do we expect Dak to fall off at age 31? That's not generally how it goes with QBs.

Manning was Elite. Russ had his times I guess, especially when he scrambled to pass. He had sweet feet and his eyes always downfield. His feet and instincts were elite. But it wasnt sustained. I think Seattle did him a disservice by not putting a better oline in front of him. Dak is my guy but He has been hurt the last couple years its just trending that way. I want to be wrong.

 

[Diehardblues]

Honestly don’t understand you at times. You go on this crusade earlier to call out the haters then make a thread that is ripe for trolling from those you call out

Like I have maintained my objective is to call out both extremes and attempt to be a voice for most fans who are more in the middle so we can have normal and civil discussions with our QB.

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

We all want a Lombardi.

Those of us who know football understand that it's a team sport.

Dak's a much better QB than a lot of guys who have won Super Bowls. We're lucky to have a top 10 QB who gives us a legitimate shot. If we EVER pair him with a great defense, look out.

You don't get it because 1) you don't know football, and 2) you're in a cult.

Which is why you won't also bash guys like Josh Allen and Justin Herbert for their lack of Super Bowl success. "No, they get a pass but Dak doesn't!!!"

We might have to say its not about lombardis.

Lets say not even about wins....for the sake of discussion.

Lets say its surgical operation of the offense, masterful passing strength, accuracy, and timing. The good old "reads the defenses" routine and can trick defenses. Clock management. Lack of mistakes. That kind of thing.

I suppose you can call it a brutal honest break down of individual skill. And not just stats alone.....since include "team play".
Where do we sit?

 

[Loso86]

I’ve attempted to set the parameter or draw the line in the sand that Elite is defined by HOF .

If we can’t agree that HOF inductees are Elite , where do we begin to set parameters beyond personal opinions ?

That's the problem now, it's many players who are not elite in the hof

 

[Praxit]

...the Elite summary-ism, is over rated. Today we need QB's, to be just good enough to win.

 

[Doomsday101]

Fans who only watches one team play believe in the myth that "elite" QBs play mistake free and never throw bad passes. Rodgers is one of the best QB to ever play. And as you can see, he only throws perfect passes.

No elite does not mean mistake free. It is however a high level of play over the course of the year and done year after year. There is no QB ever to play the game that went mistake free or did have a bad game

 

[Zman5]

No elite does not mean mistake free. It is however a high level of play over the course of the year and done year after year. There is no QB ever to play the game that went mistake free or did have a bad game

Unfortunately there are many people including posters here who do believe that.

 

[Blackspider214]

This whole "elite" or "top 5" or "top 10" argument became a non-issue for me a long time ago. I can see with my own eyes that Dak is a good enough QB to win with. That's the only "ranking" I really care about. The rest is just talking head fodder. I think it was that first 5 games of 2020 where I saw Dak reach that level that I became convinced he was now good enough to win a championship with. Where does he rank among other QBs? Who cares? He's the only starting QB on my and as such he doesn't need to be "better than so and so" for me.. He just needs to be good enough for my team to win. Which he is...

Preach.

Just another post to crap on Dak or anyone who defends him. This miserable fanbase loves to do it.

Labels are stupid. What does 'elite' even mean? Winning playoff games? Super Bowls? Getting All Pro? Dak is absolutely a top 10 QB in this league. But for some reason, every single pass he makes is dissected by the toxic people of his fanbase who legit hate this man. I even see passes for big gains and TDs, they say it wasn't a good pass because it wasn't 100% pinpoint accurate. They bend over backwards to trash him. And we get 5 threads a day about him re-hashing the same argument. The same excuses and passes Romo got, Dak doesn't. I sincerely believe they are still hurt he came in and killed it his rookie year and Romo never got his job back and decided to retire, they still hate him for that.

A good chunk of Dak's picks this year are because his WRs had skillet hands. The ant Dak crowd loved seeing Cooper Rush succeed and really thought and hoped this team would tank when Dak got bad. Because it gave them ammo to trash him even more. They turned a blind eye to how bad this offense was with Rush. They are happy when this team fails with Dak under center. They are more happy about that than winning.

 

[Diehardblues]

That's the problem now, it's many players who are not elite in the hof

I’m sorry but I think most analysts and critics would argue if you are in the HOF you were one of the best in your era . Which again most would define one of best in your era as Elite.

If we can’t establish this foundation then it’s all simply about personal preference or opinion.

At that point we start disputing MVP and All Pro selections . Establishing basis is paramount.

 

[tyke1doe]

This Dak debate reminds me of the song “Stuck in the middle with you”…

“Clowns to the left of me
Jokers to the right
Here I am stuck in the middle with you”

Dak is good but not elite, Dak is a great leader, but not always the most accurate passer, Dak is a winner but hasn’t won the big game yet…etc, etc.

Most objective fans, in my opinion, will acknowledge Dak is a good quarterback and can play at an elite level at times but can also be inconsistent.

The clowns and jokers are the “haters and fanboys” that argue all the time about Dak and the rest of us are in the middle and hope Dak can be good enough but will cheer him on as he is our QB.

Very good post.
I'm tired of the back-and-forth about whether he's elite, average or awful. (With the exception of game threads)
He's the starting quarterback. He's not going anywhere, and he's going to be a Cowboy for awhile.
We're going to the playoffs, and we're going with Dak.
If we fail, it's going to be with Dak. If we succeed, it's going to be with Dak.
I'll sit on the sidelines and avoid the arguments of what type quarterback he is until our final game for the 2022-23 season.
Then, we'll have all season to debate it.

 

[ElGatoGrande]

d bashed him earlier in his career. Are there other fans who also believe he has become Elite? I thought besides the extremes on both sides of the Haks and Homers that most felt he was closer to Top 10 to above average . Enough to build around and hopefully have more success.

Like most franchises except for a handful who have an Elite QB, you have to build around average to above average QB’s. No shame in that . Anyway, curious where the vibe is at this time . Not interested in hearing from the extremes. Thank

He makes too many bad reads and poor game time decisions but at least he hasn't been deer-in-the-headlights paralyzed and choking (lately). I like that the coaches are keeping him aggressive which is a net positive even with the added interceptions. Now if we could just get the defense to force more punts (or keep up with the takeaways).

 

[Doomsday101]

Preach.

Just another post to crap on Dak or anyone who defends him. This miserable fanbase loves to do it.

Labels are stupid. What does 'elite' even mean? Winning playoff games? Super Bowls? Getting All Pro? Dak is absolutely a top 10 QB in this league. But for some reason, every single pass he makes is dissected by the toxic people of his fanbase who legit hate this man. I even see passes for big gains and TDs, they say it wasn't a good pass because it wasn't 100% pinpoint accurate. They bend over backwards to trash him. And we get 5 threads a day about him re-hashing the same argument. The same excuses and passes Romo got, Dak doesn't. I sincerely believe they are still hurt he came in and killed it his rookie year and Romo never got his job back and decided to retire, they still hate him for that.

A good chunk of Dak's picks this year are because his WRs had skillet hands. The ant Dak crowd loved seeing Cooper Rush succeed and really thought and hoped this team would tank when Dak got bad. Because it gave them ammo to trash him even more. They turned a blind eye to how bad this offense was with Rush. They are happy when this team fails with Dak under center. They are more happy about that than winning.

Fact is some will not like Dak even if Dallas wins a SB for many they will claim they won in spite of him. Just the way it is, you have people who have taken a strong stand against Dak and will refuse to back off that. For me I like Dak and I think this team can win with him. As for elite again it is those very few who play to a very high level of play year in and year out. I don't believe Dak is elite but Dak is a very good QB and a guy who can help lead this team to a championship. As for Romo in fairness he had his critics as well, people constantly slamming him for some of the dumbest crap. Romo was a very good QB in his own right and unfortunately he was unable to get that championship. Dak still has the chance to get it done along with this team.

 

[Hadenough]

I’ve been going to bat for him in recent years against the Dak Haks but in another thread been arguing with a fan I actually agree on many issues but he believes Prescott has become Elite and in Top 5 of QB’s in the league.

He even asked me what 5 QB’s are better. Which was an easy response. Prescott is arguably by most sound analysts and critics closer to a Top 10 QB, not Top 5. Which being in the next best group isn’t a bad place to be .

The argument stemmed from a basis narrative of his that Elite QB’s were a necessity to being a consistent contender in Cap era. Which is another argument within itself . There are exceptions to that rule as well. But the argument initiated with criticism of franchises with less playoff success this era. We actually agree to a point on that basis.

And then he said Dak has become Elite. Even saying that he had bashed him earlier in his career. Are there other fans who also believe he has become Elite? I thought besides the extremes on both sides of the Haks and Homers that most felt he was closer to Top 10 to above average . Enough to build around and hopefully have more success.

Like most franchises except for a handful who have an Elite QB, you have to build around average to above average QB’s. No shame in that . Anyway, curious where the vibe is at this time . Not interested in hearing from the extremes. Thanks

To me Dak is very hard to rank. Against the NFC east he is a top 3 QB but you get outside the division and play some good teams and he has performed like he is ranked 20. I would place Dak somewhere with an overall ranking of 10 to 15. Now I will say that Dak has played well lately except for turnovers and it will be interesting to see how he performs in the playoffs.

 

[Loso86]

I’m sorry but I think most analysts and critics would argue if you are in the HOF you were one of the best in your era . Which again most would define one of best in your era as Elite.

If we can’t establish this foundation then it’s all simply about personal preference or opinion.

At that point we start disputing MVP and All Pro selections . Establishing basis is paramount.

I agree that probably 90% of players who made it in were elite. But then can we honestly say that EVERYONE in there is?. Nah there are some fan fans in there and friends

 

[Diehardblues]

I agree that probably 90% of players who made it in were elite. But then can we honestly say that EVERYONE in there is?. Nah there are some fan fans in there and friends

90% is a solid place to start. That’s how we establish a foundation or basis .

Anything we can get right 90% of the time would prob make us an expert.