Door not closed on Hardy

FuzzyLumpkins

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Because I am talking about this forum, not the world. Good lord, ease up. I was kidding to begin with.

Your sarcasm wasn't lost but that doesn't mean you don't believe in the core of what you are saying. Telling someone to lighten up when the sarcasm is directed at them is gratuitous. How about you own what you say.
 

Sydla

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I agree it's unlikely and I pretty much pay attention every day and I haven't seen the team tip their hand at all except for Jerry saying QB was not in play. Then, even if you believe that you have to take into consideration that anything they might say right now would most likely be misdirection.

They have a line in the sand with regards to the amount of money they will tie up in the RB spot. When Murray bailed to Philly, Jones was very clear in an article with Pro Football Weekly that the team had a philosophy where they would not tie up a lot of money into the TB position because they felt TBs take a pounding which could lead to a higher injury rate and they simply didn't want to have a lot of guaranteed money tied up into that spot. And then this year they showed interest in Miller, a young TB who has little wear and tear on him, but they wouldn't touch the $14MM in guaranteed money he got, after only willing to go $12MM guaranteed to Murray the year before. They even apparently called the Eagles about Murray and when it was clear that any restructure on Murray's contract would still be too much for them to swallow, they passed on Murray a 2nd time.

Now throw in the fact that a TB, picked at 4, would get nearly $25MM in guaranteed money, which would be nearly twice what they apparently were unwilling to give Miller, then it really calls into question how serious the Cowboys are about picking a TB at 4 given how they view sinking dollars into that position.
 

JoeyBoy718

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Hardy or whoever, we need a vet (or two) DE. Ideally you want some proven vets who can step up while your rookies and young players develop to their full potential. We have potential at DE but not much proven (depending on if you're ready to anoint Lawrence). We need a veteran DE. Hardy isn't the only option out there but he's definitely the most talented.
 

Idgit

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No offense, but you are being naïve if you don't think the biggest issue facing Hardy right now and why teams aren't willing to take him on is the fact that he's completely toxic from a PR perspective.

None taken. But I don't agree with you. It's difficult, because the DV issue and the PR issues are related. As I said, it's the fact that he's still reportedly heavily involved in the extra curricular activities, and the fact that he's perceived to have been largely unrepentant (and I think that characterization isn't fair, btw) about the issues. The appearance that he's violent, that he objectifies women, that he can't keep it together better for a prove-it season....this is the perception that is hurting him now, much more so than the actual DV incident itself.

Just look at how David Irving's DV issues are handled, by comparison. Nobody cares because he's not a lightening rod of a player and he's not in the spotlight. Most fans probably don't even remember he had allegations of his own brought and then later dismissed.
 

Sydla

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None taken. But I don't agree with you. It's difficult, because the DV issue and the PR issues are related. As I said, it's the fact that he's still reportedly heavily involved in the extra curricular activities, and the fact that he's perceived to have been largely unrepentant (and I think that characterization isn't fair, btw) about the issues. The appearance that he's violent, that he objectifies women, that he can't keep it together better for a prove-it season....this is the perception that is hurting him now, much more so than the actual DV incident itself.

Just look at how David Irving's DV issues are handled, by comparison. Nobody cares because he's not a lightening rod of a player and he's not in the spotlight. Most fans probably don't even remember he had allegations of his own brought and then later dismissed.

David Irving is a quarter the player Hardy is. He doesn't even cause a ripple. It has nothing to do with him being a lightning rod or not. It has to do with the fact that no one really even has a clue who David Irving is.

Ray Rice wasn't a lightning rod of a player. He wasn't a bad teammate. He didn't really cause a lot of issues in Baltimore. And no one would or will touch him with a 50 foot pole.

Why? Because the notoriety of taking on a player who is well known for a DV issue is too much for most teams to want to deal with.
 

Idgit

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David Irving is a quarter the player Hardy is. He doesn't even cause a ripple. It has nothing to do with him being a lightning rod or not. It has to do with the fact that no one really even has a clue who David Irving is.

Ray Rice wasn't a lightning rod of a player. He wasn't a bad teammate. He didn't really cause a lot of issues in Baltimore. And no one would or will touch him with a 50 foot pole.

Why? Because the notoriety of taking on a player who is well known for a DV issue is too much for most teams to want to deal with.

I'm not sure we're saying anything all that different. I've said that it's not the violence issue, but more how Hardy has handled everything stemming from that incident that's got him in trouble right now. That's basically what you're saying, right? Had Hardy apologized, kept his mouth shut, not been seen on the sidelines in what looked like a violent altercation, not mentioned guns in the press, not suggested another players wife was hot, not made the two towers references, and not gotten himself sideways with the Dallas coaching staff somehow, we'd be past the DV allegations by now. Because he didn't, he's a pariah who's still looking for a contract.

Irving is an example of a player with the same allegations on the same team where it's a complete non-issue. Not because the incidents were all that different, but because of the attention that gets paid to his circumstances. The league is full of players who have DV allegations.

And Rice is a different issue entirely, as his abuse was caught on tape and it was obviously abuse, obviously unprovoked, and was incredibly violent.
 

Sydla

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I'm not sure we're saying anything all that different. I've said that it's not the violence issue, but more how Hardy has handled everything stemming from that incident that's got him in trouble right now. That's basically what you're saying, right? Had Hardy apologized, kept his mouth shut, not been seen on the sidelines in what looked like a violent altercation, not mentioned guns in the press, not suggested another players wife was hot, not made the two towers references, and not gotten himself sideways with the Dallas coaching staff somehow, we'd be past the DV allegations by now. Because he didn't, he's a pariah who's still looking for a contract.

Irving is an example of a player with the same allegations on the same team where it's a complete non-issue. Not because the incidents were all that different, but because of the attention that gets paid to his circumstances. The league is full of players who have DV allegations.

And Rice is a different issue entirely, as his abuse was caught on tape and it was obviously abuse, obviously unprovoked, and was incredibly violent.

No what I am saying is that Hardy was a high profile player with a big NFL name and after he got into hot water over his DV issue, it was like he had the black plague to most teams. Same with Ray Rice, who unlike Hardy, wasn't a bad teammate or a headache for the Ravens. But the notoriety and bad PR he brought was more than enough for the Ravens to say see ya and other teams wouldn't touch him either. It wasn't worth it.

Irving is a different breed because if you went up to an anti-DV advocate and asked them who David Irving was, they wouldn't have a clue. Ask about Greg Hardy or Ray Rice, they'll immediately know who you are talking about.

Hardy is sitting out there in free agency not because he's a bad teammate or caused the Cowboys coaches some issues. He's out there because most teams simply just don't want to take on a guy that had such a high profile DV issue. So trying to sell his being out there in free agency still as proof the Cowboys are right in not bringing him back because he's a locker room problem is not really the case.

And by the way, Rice being on tape and Hardy not being on tape means little to those who caused problems for the NFL and were completely outspoken against the NFL. To the anti-DV contingent, they both are men who hit a woman and they don't care that one was caught on tape and one was not. And most NFL teams simply don't want to wade into that water again over DV.
 

Plankton

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Similar to what happened with Nicole Holder, none of us know truly what happened behind the scenes with Greg Hardy in Dallas. People can guess and speculate, but no one really knows.

There has been some things that have leaked out indicating that, at the very least, Hardy wasn't as punctual as he needed to be, especially on a show-me type of contract. At worst, apparently, Hardy called out the head coach of the team in front of the players, and called him a derogatory name.

Now, I will say with full candor, I have no idea what is true and what isn't. Obviously, versions of what took place are put out there by people with agendas of some kind - those who don't like him, those who may be competing for a roster spot with him, those who perhaps endured this aspect of Greg Hardy's alleged personality and behavior.

I will also say with full candor that I wasn't in favor of signing him last season, and have not wavered from that point of view.

That being said, if, as has been alleged, if he had a tardiness problem, that can be managed. It's an irritant, and can disrupt the flow of meetings, practices and the like, but it can be managed. If this is the extent of the problem that Greg Hardy presented, it does show a lack of self awareness on his part, knowing that eyes are on him and he still can't manage his time properly when he's on a one year contract. But, that should not be a disqualifier for him being brought back. Again, it's a management problem.

However, if he indeed called Garrett out, and called him an expletive in front of the team, that's a whole other ball of wax. There are lines that simply cannot be crossed without consequences. I don't care how raw locker rooms are, you don't call your coach the B word in front of everyone, and not have to be held accountable for it.

Where I wonder about whether this took place is that Hardy's playing time was never reduced during the season, and he was never suspended by the team. It would be odd for this to take place without something being done. Hell, it was reported that Marion Barber was fined for violating the dress code on a flight - think that this may have warranted the team announcing something?

And, if it did, and Garrett did nothing, which I can't see happening, then he has no control of the locker room. If he wanted to, and Jones blocked him from doing it, then he has emasculated Garrett in a worse manner than he has any coach that preceded him.

Whether you like Jason Garrett or not, that would be the absolute worst outcome possible, because it then means that no coach would have a chance here as long as Jerry Jones is alive, and running things.
 

texbumthelife

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Your sarcasm wasn't lost but that doesn't mean you don't believe in the core of what you are saying. Telling someone to lighten up when the sarcasm is directed at them is gratuitous. How about you own what you say.

Just to enlighten you a little, I want Bosa too... How's that for owning what I say? Jesus, have a beer and relax.
 

TRUTH87

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This DE thing freakn sucks. We got a buncha guys who we think have nice upside but we gota be realistic and not all are gona pan out.

Gregory - high expectations
Irving - got upside
Mayowa - got upside
Lawrence - hopefully continues where he left off

We def need a couple vets.
 

GimmeTheBall!

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Yes, I don't believe that Jason would be very happy.

Should the Cowboys bring Greg Hardy back?

Mosley: "I don't think you bring back Hardy. You talk about emasculating your head coach? That's what it would be. Jason Garrett wants him gone. This guy was disruptive by reportedly partying too much and showing up late to meetings. If Stephen found a way to keep him, Jason would look so weak. Draft Joey Bosa and move on with your lives."
1457740224-NS_25cows55AJ.jpg



http://sportsday.***BANNED-URL***/d...boys-bring-back-greg-hardy-sake-jason-garrett

What tha?
What is Jason looking at? Wot? Wot?
 

FuzzyLumpkins

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Just to enlighten you a little, I want Bosa too... How's that for owning what I say? Jesus, have a beer and relax.

I was talking about the sarcasm. Passive aggressive sarcasm still has a target for all of your dissembling.

I'm not upset btw. Perhaps you should take your own medicine.
 

texbumthelife

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I was talking about the sarcasm. Passive aggressive sarcasm still has a target for all of your dissembling.

I'm not upset btw. Perhaps you should take your own medicine.

I didn't say you were upset. I said relax.

Yes, there was a target, myself. As someone in the Bosa camp, I was joking that I could say "I told you so." Thinking that comment is directed at you is about as egotistical as it gets.

Lighten up. Have a snickers. Move on.
 

DTown214

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This DE thing freakn sucks. We got a buncha guys who we think have nice upside but we gota be realistic and not all are gona pan out.

Gregory - high expectations
Irving - got upside
Mayowa - got upside
Lawrence - hopefully continues where he left off

We def need a couple vets.

D-Ware sure would be perfect for this team right about now...
 

DMX690

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No the door is shut on the Kraken, unless he wants play for vet min. Too bad
 

Aven8

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Similar to what happened with Nicole Holder, none of us know truly what happened behind the scenes with Greg Hardy in Dallas. People can guess and speculate, but no one really knows.

There has been some things that have leaked out indicating that, at the very least, Hardy wasn't as punctual as he needed to be, especially on a show-me type of contract. At worst, apparently, Hardy called out the head coach of the team in front of the players, and called him a derogatory name.

Now, I will say with full candor, I have no idea what is true and what isn't. Obviously, versions of what took place are put out there by people with agendas of some kind - those who don't like him, those who may be competing for a roster spot with him, those who perhaps endured this aspect of Greg Hardy's alleged personality and behavior.

I will also say with full candor that I wasn't in favor of signing him last season, and have not wavered from that point of view.

That being said, if, as has been alleged, if he had a tardiness problem, that can be managed. It's an irritant, and can disrupt the flow of meetings, practices and the like, but it can be managed. If this is the extent of the problem that Greg Hardy presented, it does show a lack of self awareness on his part, knowing that eyes are on him and he still can't manage his time properly when he's on a one year contract. But, that should not be a disqualifier for him being brought back. Again, it's a management problem.

However, if he indeed called Garrett out, and called him an expletive in front of the team, that's a whole other ball of wax. There are lines that simply cannot be crossed without consequences. I don't care how raw locker rooms are, you don't call your coach the B word in front of everyone, and not have to be held accountable for it.

Where I wonder about whether this took place is that Hardy's playing time was never reduced during the season, and he was never suspended by the team. It would be odd for this to take place without something being done. Hell, it was reported that Marion Barber was fined for violating the dress code on a flight - think that this may have warranted the team announcing something?

And, if it did, and Garrett did nothing, which I can't see happening, then he has no control of the locker room. If he wanted to, and Jones blocked him from doing it, then he has emasculated Garrett in a worse manner than he has any coach that preceded him.

Whether you like Jason Garrett or not, that would be the absolute worst outcome possible, because it then means that no coach would have a chance here as long as Jerry Jones is alive, and running things.

So Hardy really called JG that? Where did you here this?
 
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