Draft Musings - March 29

[Kaiser]

I'm not referring to cost, but quality. The fact that the people inside that building thought that any of those guys was a potential answer is an indictment of their ability to judge talent at the position.

Nahh, I still disagree. The Cowboys didn't think any of Vaughn, Weeden or Cassel was "the answer" at QB, they thought they would be a serviceable backup or a development project in Vaughn's case. Half the teams in the NFL dont' have a starting caliber QB as their starter, very few have one as their backup.

And you can't separate the cost from the quality in player acquisition. Saying Dallas can't find QBs when you site a UDFA, a waiver wire pickup (with the minimum salary) and Cassel is like saying Dallas can't find OTs because of Darrion Weems, John Wetzel and Laurence Gibson. They cost nothing and its meaningless when you look at the first round pick spent on Tyron Smith.

 

[AzorAhai]

Half the teams in the NFL dont' have a starting caliber QB as their starter, very few have one as their backup.

This is true, which is why you don't screw around and draft for now vs the next 12 years of the franchise. If you see a QB you like at 4, just send in the card.

It doesn't sound like it matters what the grade is on them though. Romo is here, and he's the horse they want to ride come hell or high water. Nobody can really complain if they went into the process looking hard at these QBs and just don't like them. You have to trust your scouts. When Jerry seems completely dismissive of the idea because of Romos 5 year window, well then I have a huge problem with that. I can only hope it's a smokescreen, because if not they really are idiots that just don't get it.

 

[SilverStarCowboy]

Or all of the QBs in the top of this Draft could very easily bust/fail, then who was the IDIOT?

 

[AzorAhai]

Or all of the QBs in the top of this Draft could very easily bust/fail, then who was the IDIOT?

If you have something to say to me try using that reply button under my post.

 

[Stash]

Nahh, I still disagree. The Cowboys didn't think any of Vaughn, Weeden or Cassel was "the answer" at QB, they thought they would be a serviceable backup or a development project in Vaughn's case. Half the teams in the NFL dont' have a starting caliber QB as their starter, very few have one as their backup.

And whatever they thought about any of them, they were dead wrong. And their awful track record with any and every quarterback not named Tomo brings their ability to identify talent into question.

And you can't separate the cost from the quality in player acquisition. Saying Dallas can't find QBs when you site a UDFA, a waiver wire pickup (with the minimum salary) and Cassel is like saying Dallas can't find OTs because of Darrion Weems, John Wetzel and Laurence Gibson. They cost nothing and its meaningless when you look at the first round pick spent on Tyron Smith.

It sure looks like it cost them a season to me.

The fact is that we can go on, and on, and on, and on about the Cowboys' repeated failures in the quarterback department. Other than Romo, it's been a dumpster fire since Aikman retired. Failure, after failure, after failure. No matter who they drafted, no matter who they signed, no matter who they traded for. None of them have worked and none of them have won when called upon.

 

[Stash]

If you have something to say to me try using that reply button under my post.

It's trolling, plain and simple. He takes repeated pot shots at the quarterback idea while not being capable of actually presenting facts for a debate. He brings nothing to the conversation and I'm amazed that he's been allowed to get away with the obvious tactic for this long.

 

[DBOY3141]

really? you mean the same guys who were "fine" with Weeden & Cassell until we finally had to put Moore in there cause it was so bad.

yep, those same two guys. does that surprise you? it doesn't me.

 

[big dog cowboy]

If the team doesn't believe Goff is a franchise QB then it shouldn't take Goff.

I would prefer in that case to take the "bum" in the third round and see if he can be developed rather than waste the fourth pick on a guy the team doesn't believe is any better (if that's the case).

What I see a lot of is fans preparing to call the Joneses stupid if they don't take a first-round QB, no matter how their scouting department feels about those QBs. I consider it smart to follow the advice of your scouting department. If the scouts end up being wrong, then you need new scouts.

Exactly right.

 

[reddyuta]

Exactly right.

I won't be upset if the scouts think that but if they pass on a franchise QB because they think Romo can play 4 more years then we have no hope of ever winning another SB.

 

[Direwolf63]

Speaking of things we've never seen, no team has ever been dumb enough to use a #4 pick on a backup quarterback... fortunately it looks like that will continue.

Phillip Rivers backed up Drew Brees his rookie year.

 

[Direwolf63]

And whatever they thought about any of them, they were dead wrong. And their awful track record with any and every quarterback not named Tomo brings their ability to identify talent into question.



It sure looks like it cost them a season to me.

The fact is that we can go on, and on, and on, and on about the Cowboys' repeated failures in the quarterback department. Other than Romo, it's been a dumpster fire since Aikman retired. Failure, after failure, after failure. No matter who they drafted, no matter who they signed, no matter who they traded for. None of them have worked and none of them have won when called upon.

And finding Romo was pure, blind luck. They almost cut him.

 

[Dhragon]

The problem is that the Cowboys have given some indication that it doesn't matter where they have these guys ranked, they might simply not even consider a QB at 4 due to some bizarre belief that Romo is going to play until he's 65 years old.

Hyperbole aside, I know some here will say that if Dallas passes on a QB at 4 it will be because they didn't think one was worth that high a pick but it's equally likely that the Cowboys also thought the QBs were worthy of that pick but given they believe Romo is a viable option for another half decade, they passed on the QB and went with best positional player to build around Romo.

Given how this organization thinks and acts, I tend to believe they'll ding a QB in their rankings because they simply don't think they need one.

That's right, we'll probably never know the reason unless Jerry gets drunk and spills the reason afterwards. Yet both sides of the QB at #4 debate will claim the option that fits their agenda and state it as a fact. I know I will

 

[SilverStarCowboy]

It's trolling, plain and simple. He takes repeated pot shots at the quarterback idea while not being capable of actually presenting facts for a debate. He brings nothing to the conversation and I'm amazed that he's been allowed to get away with the obvious tactic for this long.

lol- I don't always reply to you for obvious reasons.

All I stated was who is the idiot if they bust. The answer is the GM, not the self perceived protagonist fan.

 

[DFWJC]

Last year is really the only year in the Romo era where Dallas got seriously burned for not having an adequate backup.

I keep reading post that make it sound like this has been happening on a regular basis.
And btw, most people around the league thought Cassell should be considered a quality backup. Not a long term starter, but certainly a quality backup. It didn't work out though.

 

[big dog cowboy]

I won't be upset if the scouts think that but if they pass on a franchise QB because they think Romo can play 4 more years

If they pass on a QB at 4 it won't be because they think Romo can play 4 more years.

 

[Kaiser]

It sure looks like it cost them a season to me.

OK, I'll bite. What starting quality QB was available on the waiver wire or UDFA that could have stepped in as a quality starter when Romo went down?

And its kind of a trick question, in hindsight I think the team would have been better off starting Kellen Moore as soon as Romo went down. But Weeden is a guy that looks terrific in practice, no body predicted that he would turn into a checkdown machine in live action.

 

[LandryFan]

If the team doesn't believe Goff is a franchise QB then it shouldn't take Goff.

I would prefer in that case to take the "bum" in the third round and see if he can be developed rather than waste the fourth pick on a guy the team doesn't believe is any better (if that's the case).

What I see a lot of is fans preparing to call the Joneses stupid if they don't take a first-round QB, no matter how their scouting department feels about those QBs. I consider it smart to follow the advice of your scouting department. If the scouts end up being wrong, then you need new scouts.

There will be a lot of people around here calling the Jones's stupid no matter what. Even if the Jones's do what they want them to do, if that player happens to not pan out to be the player they were projected to be, then the Jones's will be stupid for not having known better (even though the fan didn't know better, either) . If the player works out to be what they were projected to have been, then the Jones's were (A) smart for following that fan's opinion , and (B) Got very lucky because they normally can't/don't do anything right. That's just the way it works around here. Truth be told, I read a lot of the opinions on this site and there are even a few truly knowledgeable people here, but I don't put a plug nickel's worth of value on any of them, because, for the most part, they just regurgitate what the mass media feeds them (which is complete garbage in a lot of cases). At the risk of being labeled a "blind homer", I prefer to trust in the scouting department and go with their evaluations. Not one team hits on all of their picks...hell, even the infallible Cheaters didn't pick Brady till the 6th round. I mean come on, a QB that many will put in the conversation for GOAT wasn't considered to be better than a 6th round pick by nary a single team??? The draft is an inexact science, to put it lightly. I just hope we hit on the top three picks. Anything more will be gravy, IMHO.

 

[Super_Kazuya]

Phillip Rivers backed up Drew Brees his rookie year.

The team had every intention of making him the starter but he held out (Brees stunk in '03) and reported to camp too late. Even then he was always going to be the starter as evidenced by them saying bye bye to Brees even after he made the Pro Bowl. The Cowboys are already on record saying that Romo is the long term starter, so they would be drafting a backup at 4. Which would be mind-numbingly stupid (Note that this is separate from whether counting on Romo to start 4-5 years is a good move, I am just going on the facts as given).

 

[LandryFan]

I'd happily take 90-95% of chart value this year, personally.

Why? Ten percent of our 1st round pick is 180 points which is equal to a mid third round pick. This is the type of draft, by most accounts, where the real value lies in the second third, and fourth rounds. That said, it also depends on if you're trying to sell your pick or if your pick is being sought by others. Each scenario has a drastically different influences on the value that can be obtained.

 

[Doc50]

Are you talking about draft boards or are you talking about prospect ratings?

I don't believe Goff will get past pick No. 7 either, but not because he's considered the seventh-best prospect in the draft.

One site I just looked at (Daniel Jeremiah) has Wentz rated 7th and Goff 8th. Lance Zierlein had Goff eighth and Wentz 30th on Jan. 19 (don't know if his opinion has changed since then).

SI.com on Feb. 29 had Goff 15th and Wentz 40th. BAN-INCOMING-IN-3-2-1 on March 16 had Wentz 7th and Goff 11th. CBS Sports had Goff 5th and Wentz 7th. Ourlads has Wentz 6th and Goff 10th.

Scouts Inc., who I've been using in my mocks, had Wentz 9th and Goff 10th on March 8.

That's just from a cursory look.

Those post-combine rankings are fairly reasonable, and I don't think either of the 2 will be a bust.
But everyone wants an elite franchise QB who is also durable -- that's where the uncertainty lies.

I really don't think the 'Boys are going there anyway -- Romo will be expected to be kept upright by an even better OL, and there has been no reason to fret about his arm or wheels.

My guess is they'll roll the dice with a mid-round QB, trade down from #4 unless Ramsey is there, and try to land as many system blue-chip guys as possible, relying on their own evaluations.

Very interesting draft, as usual.