ESPN: Barber v. Jones

[theogt]

Barber coudn't beat my grandmother in a foot race...

40 Time:
Julius Jones: 4.47
Marion Barber: 4.49

Your grandma must be fast.

Some other interesting facts:

Broad Jump:
Jones: 10'1"
Barber: 10'7"

Vertical Jump:
Jones: 37-1/2
Barber: 40

Shuttle:
Jones: 4.16
Barber: 4.17

But do go on thinking that Jones is faster or more athletic. Please, do ignore the facts.

Don't count your chickens before they hatch with Romo.. The NFL has been full of one trick ponies.

Great. Now I know you can't be taken seriously.

 

[MarionBarberThe4th]

Barber coudn't beat my grandmother in a foot race...

What do you have against Barber? You sound like your defending JJ over a Commander, Eagle, or Giant RB

 

[MarionBarberThe4th]

but those who keep insisting that Marion is a better running back than Julius is are essentially saying that their talent evaluation skills are superior to those of Bill Parcells, a notion that I find laughable..

Im 90% sure your joking with that statement, so no response necessary

 

[theogt]

Personally, I like having both guys on the team, they complement each other, but those who keep insisting that Marion is a better running back than Julius is are essentially saying that their talent evaluation skills are superior to those of Bill Parcells, a notion that I find laughable...

Dude, I disagreed with Parcells on talent evaluation in numerous situations. This isn't the only one. I don't base my decisions on other people's opinions.

 

[Achozen]

What do you have against Barber? You sound like your defending JJ over a Commander, Eagle, or Giant RB

Seriously.

Barber was put in situations where even when he had nowhere to go he gained positive yards. JJ talked about Tuna having him run like a robot but, Barber played in the same system and I never saw him look tentative like Jones looked at times.

 

[MarionBarberThe4th]

I wouldnt be surprised to see some photoshopped pictures of Barber soon. Getting drunk with Eli

 

[Hoofbite]

OK LET ME MAKE THIS PLAIN AND SIMPLE.... A LOT OF MARION BARBER CARRIES CAME WHEN TEAMS WEREN'T EXPECTING THE RUN, SO THEREFORE YOU WILL SEE A LOT OF B.S. YARDS.

How can you say that? Over 70% of his carries where on 1st and 2nd down. Neither being automatic passing downs so I don't know why teams wouldn't expect the run.

Also, I guess you could say that teams weren't expecting the run later in the game either if you wanted. I mean after all the years of coaching, teams never figured out that BP would run all the clock he could in the 2nd half. Just about 70% of Barbers carries where in the 2nd half.


Im not saying that teams were fully aware and couldn't do a thing if they wanted to but to say they were totally left in the dark is a little far-stretched.

 

[Big Dakota]

I hate EVERYTHING Minnesota, except the Golden Gophers, as i've had a couple friends from my reservation play basketball for Clem Haskins years ago. I have followed the Gophers for 18 years and i'd venture to guess i've seen as much or more of MBIII than anyone here. I watched them almost every weekend when he was there. He does the same thing here that he did there. He runs hard, almost always gains yards, moves the chains and score TDs. He's never had the chance to be a feature, but i think he could carry the ball 250 times. I was a HUGE supporter of his over at the Cowboys-Forum when i was over there. The only bad thing anyone can say about MBIII is he's never had the chance to run the ball 250+ times in the NFL and he's not a sub 4.4 guy. He was a steal where he was taken and he does everything well. He gains yards, catches the ball, blocks and picks up the blitz. He may be a blue collar back, but he's also very productive with or without the ball in his hands. I can see sticking up for JJ but i can't see hatin on MBIII as he's been great for the Cowbouys and will in all likelyhood send JJ packing.

 

[cowboyeric8]

Agree to dissagree. The Barber vs. Jones crap gets old. Be happy we have 2 pretty good running backs. And we will all wait and see what happens this year, it will all sort itself out.

 

[David276]

Yeah, i hope they start Marion Barber a game or two im really interested in seeing how he does against a "Fresh" defense. That seems to be the most popular argument against him.

 

[AdamJT13]

In stark contrast, Jones was stuffed 26 times in 267 carries, producing a .097 rate that was among the very worst in the game.

Julius' 0.97 was nowhere near the "very worst in the game." Out of the 47 running backs who had at least 100 carries last season, Julius' stuff percentage ranked 26th-lowest, so he was just a little worse than average. Among the 21 backs with a higher stuff percentage were Ladell Betts (0.98), Tiki Barber (.1009), Clinton Portis (.1024), Laurence Maroney (.1086), Shaun Alexander (.1230), Willis McGahee (.1236), Reggie Bush (.1419), Kevin Jones (.1436) and DeAngelo Williams (.1653).

Jones also averaged only 4.0 yards per carry on first-and-10 situations -- again, one of the very worst marks in the league.

Also not true.

I think Nick Ravitz looked at the list of NFL leaders in those categories, saw Julius near the bottom and assumed he was "among the very worst." He apparently forgot that he was looking at a list of the leaders -- so the "very worst" weren't even on the list.

 

[superpunk]

The stuff percentage is really telling in the difference between these two backs.

Even if Julius isn't among the worst in that stat, and Ravitz misinterpreted - at best he's below average. The difference being that Julius doesn't have half the "high's" that some of those other back's Adam mentioned do. Barber might not approach their high's either, but at least he wasn't continually putting us in bad situations on 2nd and third down.

And the notion that Barber was a passing down's back needs to end.

Half his carries came on first down. Nearly 3/4 of them came on 1st and second down (when teams are expecting the run) - and according to his splits, he only got 12 carries on 3rd and 6+ all year. It's the same people I see just droning on and on about how "Barber was mostly out there in passing situations" and "I hated our conservative offense....all we ever did on 3rd down was run draws to Barber...."

It really is like people aren't even watching the Cowboys.

 

[dogunwo]

OK LET ME MAKE THIS PLAIN AND SIMPLE.... A LOT OF MARION BARBER CARRIES CAME WHEN TEAMS WEREN'T EXPECTING THE RUN, SO THEREFORE YOU WILL SEE A LOT OF B.S. YARDS.

Oh great, look at the can you are about to open..........

 

[THUMPER]

I believe it is called "Fantasy Football" for a reason. Who gives a damn.

 

[dogunwo]

I believe it is called "Fantasy Football" for a reason. Who gives a damn.

Championship..................................

 

[Hoov]

I'll take barber over jones in a heartbeat. i think he's a better football player period.

 

[burmafrd]

Actually on short yardage carries you have less of a chance of being stuffed for a loss. The play is given extra blocking. Only a real breakdown by the O line allows a back to get stuffed on a short ydg play. I will accept AdamJT13's words on that.
By the way, JJ was timed at 4.38 at the combine- the second fastest back that year next to Tatum Bell, who had a 4.37. As an Irish fan, I watched the whole time JJ was on at the combine. He was also timed sub 4.4 at ND, and in HS. Given all those times he was at that level, saying he had a 4.47 as his best time is somewhat misleading. From observation over the last 2 years it is clear that JJ has a significant edge in overall speed. What has MB3's longest run been?

 

[Alexander]

From observation over the last 2 years it is clear that JJ has a significant edge in overall speed. What has MB3's longest run been?

You might want to drop the issue related to longer runs in this argument. You will lose.

Jones had but one more 20+ run with nearly twice as many carries. He's had only 13 carries longer than 20 in his career (7 for Barber) and this is for a supposed speed back who is supposed to provide a big play dimension.

Speed for a tailback is a very overrated quality anyways. Neither Brown, Payton or Emmitt Smith were 4.3 burners. Part of Jones' problem and why he struggled some is partially due to his speed. If he's got a huge hole, he can hit it quickly and get in gear. He doesn't gear up or down very well when he's not in the open field. His short area burst and vision just isn't there. Barber is fast enough and has more explosion in a smaller area. Once he's in the open field, he's not going to take it all the way. He's just a better short yardage runner. And that is all this article was speaking to anyways.

Both have their strengths and weaknesses. If they didn't we wouldn't have this debate nearly every day.

 

[Alexander]

In what regard? Falling down on impact? I assure you, he takes the cake there.

He does this almost as much as Hambrick did. That's another valid comparison if you are into the Hambrick narrative.

 

[burmafrd]

Actually JJ has a very good burst- his 10 yd times were the best at the combine. Its that and his quick feet that allowed him to make the plays he did make in 2004. Actually, in top end speed, he probably is not all that much faster then MB3- but its his acceleration and quick feet that make the difference. Its like a light car with a smaller engine vs a big car with a bigger engine: your 1/4 mile time will be much better with the smaller car, but take it over a mile or two and the difference might be a lot less. JJ has had quite a few runs of 30 yds +. How many has MB3 had. The 20 yd stat is misleading- a lot of slow backs can have 20 yd runs if they catch the D right. 30+ , or better yet 40+ shows who the real burners are.