First impressive Jaylon video

[KJJ]

I just gave you the best opinion you will get and still you kling to your misconceptions. It is ok to be wrong.

You can provide whatever options you want I'm saying there's no guarantees with him especially returning to an elite level. If there were any guarantees someone would've drafted him in the first round.

 

[KJJ]

Lattimore's nerve reinnervated fully. His issue was chronic knee pain. That is not an issue with Jaylon.

I didn't say they had the same issue read my post.

 

[Bohuntr97]

does bohuntr really mean boutty?

Only in your world

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Smart Teams devoid of talent on defense don't take chances on Players with drug issues or injuries. Just because a decision comes out right doesn't mean it was a smart decision. It could be just luck and that eventually runs out. He's ours now and I hope he fully recovers. But I hope our front office stops taking chances like him in the 2nd round.

Smart teams manage risk and adjust tiering players with issues like that accordingly. Every player has some risk associated with them. Most players fail in the NFL and for every Josh Gordon there is a Tyran Mathieu.

Luck is an illusion and every probable outcome is judged individually.

If you think they should have waited even longer that is one thing but to just put them in the box seems the opposite of an intelligent approach.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I didn't say they had the same issue read my post.

You also said that you heard of encouraging progress with Lattimore and are using that as a basis for skepticism for Smith.

I am telling you that while Lattimore's nerve reinnervated, his knee never recovered and he had chronic pain and swelling. That is not what happened with Jaylon so bringing it up is gratuitous nonsense.

 

[Vinnie2u]

Smart teams manage risk and adjust tiering players with issues like that accordingly. Every player has some risk associated with them. Most players fail in the NFL and for every Josh Gordon there is a Tyran Mathieu.

Luck is an illusion and every probable outcome is judged individually.

If you think they should have waited even longer that is one thing but to just put them in the box seems the opposite of an intelligent approach.

When round would of Pittsburg, GB, Giants, Seattle, NE, Baltimore taken Jaylon. Besides that BS rumor of NE taking him.

 

[xwalker]

So you think that design will allow you to bend your foot down at the ankle? What part do you think bends?

I'm not saying that he is definitely wearing any type of brace. I'm just saying that he might be wearing one.

It could be the hinged type or it could be the leaf-spring type.


In regards to the leaf-spring type AFO:
Have you ever held an automobile leaf spring in your hands? It feels like a rigid piece of metal, but with enough weight, it bends. Engineer the right type and size of material and it works as a spring. If the material is to rigid or too flexible for the application, then it's worthless.

A leaf-spring is similar to a bow (as in bow and arrow). You can bend it, but it will return back to it's natural state when you release the bend pressure.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

When round would of Pittsburg, GB, Giants, Seattle, NE, Baltimore taken Jaylon. Besides that BS rumor of NE taking him.

I have no idea and I am not going to speak for those teams.

 

[Bohuntr97]

does bohuntr really mean boutty?

No genious, it means I can kill with a bow. Compound, long, or recurve. I have all.

 

[waldoputty]

Smart Teams devoid of talent on defense don't take chances on Players with drug issues or injuries. Just because a decision comes out right doesn't mean it was a smart decision. It could be just luck and that eventually runs out. He's ours now and I hope he fully recovers. But I hope our front office stops taking chances like him in the 2nd round.

All draft picks are risky.
It is which risk you choose.
You have talent risk, injury risk and/or mental risk.

I think we all agree that you need at least a couple game changers in a defense.
Lee is sort of one - and we got him because we took an injury risk.
The question is how do you get another 1 or 2 game changers.

We went for Zeke at #4 and no one will argue that call.
So the question is how do you get another game changer at #34.
If you take a talent-risk, you know you will not get the game changer.
The only de that was talented was not on the board because of off-field trouble - so we choose not to take the mental risk (perhaps due to Gregory).
So you can go for a safe pick or swing for the fences and take a big injury risk.

Let say the surgeon said you had 50-50 chance of getting a 90% pre-injury Jaylon.
That becomes an extremely good gamble.
Potential game changers like Jaylon are only available in top 10 picks.
That would be same odds as hitting on a starter LB in the 2nd round.
The downside is he might never return.

In my view - this is the Jaylon gamble only meant to be made by 'big boys' who is not worried about getting fired - I would make that gamble 10 out of 10 times:

Jaylon pick:
50% game changer LB - 50% so-so player/never play a down.

This is the normal value of a second round LB pick:
55% starter or better LB - 50% / so-so player

The 55% is from real numbers:
1st Round - OL (83%) LB (70%) TE (67%) DB (64%) QB (63%) WR (58%) RB (58%) DL (58%)
2nd Round - OL (70%) LB (55%) TE (50%) WR (49%) DB (46%) QB (27%) DL (26%) RB (25%)
http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2015/2/20/8072877/what-the-statistics-tell-us-about-the-draft-by-round

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I'm not saying that he is definitely wearing any type of brace. I'm just saying that he might be wearing one.

It could be the hinged type or it could be the leaf-spring type.


In regards to the leaf-spring type AFO:
Have you ever held an automobile leaf spring in your hands? It feels like a rigid piece of metal, but with enough weight, it bends. Engineer the right type and size of material and it works as a spring. If the material is to rigid or too flexible for the application, then it's worthless.

A leaf-spring is similar to a bow (as in bow and arrow). You can bend it, but it will return back to it's natural state when you release the bend pressure.

So you think that

allows a range of motion from

to

and I am well aware of what a leaf spring does and automotive ones do not give very much even under load.

They are called semi-rigid for a reason.

 

[waldoputty]

Only in your world

it is good that you will give one up for the team

 

[waldoputty]

I'm not saying that he is definitely wearing any type of brace. I'm just saying that he might be wearing one.

It could be the hinged type or it could be the leaf-spring type.


In regards to the leaf-spring type AFO:
Have you ever held an automobile leaf spring in your hands? It feels like a rigid piece of metal, but with enough weight, it bends. Engineer the right type and size of material and it works as a spring. If the material is to rigid or too flexible for the application, then it's worthless.

A leaf-spring is similar to a bow (as in bow and arrow). You can bend it, but it will return back to it's natural state when you release the bend pressure.

It does not matter whether he is wearing an AFO or not.
The fact of the matter is that he moved his foot up and down rapidly to match the rate of jumping those barriers.
It is virtually impossible for the spring constants of those springs to be matched the rate of jumping.
Furthermore, spring action is not controlled but open-loop.
You dont see Jaylon's foot wiggling out of control - it was precise firm movement - no way a spring does that unless the muscle is in control.
Muscle in control = nerve controlling the muscle - ie nerve 'firing'...

 

[waldoputty]

No genious, it means I can kill with a bow. Compound, long, or recurve. I have all.

wow, threatening response

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Then of course there is the fact that any force applied to pick the foot up is going to act in the opposite direction of the force your calf is applying to push the foot down making a fluid gait all but impossible.

I just think its funny that he gives credence to a semi-rigid AFO being used after seeing that fluid bilateral motion we see him jumping with.

 

[xwalker]

This is the brace he was using: http://www.richiebrace.com/index.php/products/the-richie-otc-dynamic-assist.html

IT says specifically: "provide up to 15 degrees of dorsiflexion of the foot at the ankle joint during the swing phase of gait."

dorsiflexion
[dor″sĭ-flek´shun]
backward flexion or bending, as of the hand or foot.

It does not allow you to dip your feet. It's designed to allow a heel to toe gait.

Even low res you can tell that he is not wearing this

Dorsiflexion is allowing the toe(s) to go up.

Plantar flexion is the angle that you are talking about when you say his feet angle down at 45% when he is jumping.

 

[waldoputty]

Then of course there is the fact that any force applied to pick the foot up is going to act in the opposite direction of the force your calf is applying to push the foot down making a fluid gait all but impossible.

I just think its funny that he gives credence to a semi-rigid AFO being used after seeing that fluid bilateral motion we see him jumping with.

You mean an AFO that provides support but does not limit his range of motion?

 

[Melonfeud]

Looking at his guns isn't going to tell you if he can return to form. There's a lot of players who look like Tarzan and play like Jane, we'll find out in the coming months where Smith is as a football player.

O.k.,,, but have you watched any recent video of him running/cutting? If so, where does that not correlate as to actual scrimmage/ game time abilities( I've only watched some of his pre injury highlights when we drafted him on YouTube, likewise with Dak &Zeke) I can imagine he might be hesitant and a little tentative at first going all out full contact simply because in the back of his mind he knows bad ***t happened to his knee /leg and could possibly pull back (so to speak) that's just self preservation, so I understand and can pick up on what your laying down,not that I agree but I see where your coming from.

My view is he's chomping on the bit(again, so to speak) to play /prove himself and only he knows at what stage of recovery he's at(tweets from him like:good to go/let's rock/bring it=CHAMPIONSHIP you can bank that)

 

[xwalker]

You also said that you heard of encouraging progress with Lattimore and are using that as a basis for skepticism for Smith.

I am telling you that while Lattimore's nerve reinnervated, his knee never recovered and he had chronic pain and swelling. That is not what happened with Jaylon so bringing it up is gratuitous nonsense.

@KJJ

Lattimore's nerve recovered from everything that I've researched. His knee was just never right structurally.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Dorsiflexion is allowing the toe(s) to go up.

Plantar flexion is the angle that you are talking about when you say his feet angle down at 45% when he is jumping.

That is what my picture showed. Thanks for agreeing with me.

The point I was making is that they brace we have seen him wear before would not allow him to bend his foot down.

Please point me to the part on the product page where it says it allows plantarflexion. As I said it is designed to allow a heel to toe walking motion where you pick your toes up, dorsiflexion, and the normal force and the roll from the motion push the toes down to flat.