News: Garrett chimes in on Dez's involvement in the offense

[Mr Cowboy]

I wish for just one game we intentionally force feed Dez the ball. Just to see if it works. I guess we'll never see it though

I wish they would design plays for Dez to go in motion, and run crossing patterns, making it harder for defenses to double him. Instead they run him into double coverage, by play design. It's nothing new, Garrett has been doing it for years.

You look at the other top WRs, they line up all over the place and run all kinds of crossing patterns. AJ Green made Revis look stupid, by play design. Not in Dallas.....Green, Julio, AB, would all look like Dez if they played in Dallas.

 

[Idgit]

It's not about pass distribution. No one said Prescott should force the ball into Bryant, especially if Garrett continues to use him as he does.

But why does Atlanta move Julio Jones around? Inside, outside, in motion, etc?

Because it makes it tougher to defend him. By moving him around they can sometimes work favorable match ups.

Garrett makes it easy to defend Bryant because he uses him certain ways. The fact you can't see that just shows how far into the tank you are for Garrett.

Mediocre head coach. Plain and simple.

Thanks for the elementary explanation of how WRs play football. To be clear, you didn't see him in the X, Z, or slot enough? Which was it?

And, for the record, I don't buy that Dez Bryant is easier to defend just because he's not in motion. I think that's a cop out. The aren't many players in the league you want more than you want Dez Bryant coming off the line to beat press coverage who have the speed and the play making ability on the ball to beat CBs downfield and the quickness to beat them inside off the snap. I think you've been listening to Bryan Broaddus too much. They moved Dez around the lineup yesterday. He didn't beat his coverage. And the plays were there to be made. Re-watch them.

Also for the record, I'm dubious that you have any idea what level of involvement the HC has in how Dez gets used from game to game. I think you're guessing, because you want something else to complain about.

 

[yimyammer]

And it's an offensive driven league, where rules favor the offense

except, ironically, when it comes to our #! WR

 

[yimyammer]

Check the video at the 2:27 mark. But, hey, it sounds good, right?

was that Campo at about 2:05? Was he on that staff?

 

[Idgit]

I can't speak for everyone. But for me I don't want Dak forcing the ball to Dez if he is covered. Saying Dez needs to be more involved with the offense means they need to find plays and formations where it's not so simple to double Dez. If this means lining him up in the slot for a handful of plays while Butler takes his WR spot then do it. If it means putting DEz in motion constantly then do it....

What we are tired of watching is this "take what they give us" strategy. You don't win taking what they give you because everyone is too good and what they will give you is a steaming pile of crap. When you have the talent on offense that we have you need to use your weapons to force the defense to not control your play calling. Watch a team like the saints or Steelers. These teams are not more talented than we are yet they don't sit back and wait for the defenses to tell them what they are allowed to have. They go take it.

The Saints and Steelers are more talented than we are, I think, even with Tony in the huddle. It's a lot closer with Tony in there, though. I always break offensive production down to look at the points/offensive series since it nets out possession variances and defensive and ST scores. It's a stat where we perform well relative to the rest of the league with Tony in the lineup, at least.

And we would have performed well there yesterday, too, if Dez had held onto his ball and if Beasley had held onto his. And then nobody would be talking about putting Dez in motion more or whatever it is today.

I'm sorry, but watching where Dak went with the ball yesterday, I just don't have a problem with his decisions. The guys were open, and most of them were catching it better than Dez did. If it weren't for the blatant drops, or the jailbreaks on Free or the holding penalties putting us in low-percentage situations, we were playing smart football. People see the final score and conclude 'we need to put Dez in motion' or 'Dez needs to run more slants.' The reality--I think--is out interior OL needed to block better without holding. Free needed to counter the inside move better. And the guys we did throw to needed to come down with the footballs that they got their hands on. Or they just need to get out of bounds for us to take the shot at the GW kick.

I don't see the need to complicate it any more than that. And I think those fundamentals come down to coaching, too. Either coach them to hold onto the ball and to get out of bounds, or coach them from the bench and put somebody else in the lineup. Just make the damn plays that are there to be made and let's not pretend that, if Dez were just in motion, he's going to make that catch he didn't make in the first place.

 

[Sydla]

Thanks for the elementary explanation of how WRs play football. To be clear, you didn't see him in the X, Z, or slot enough? Which was it?

And, for the record, I don't buy that Dez Bryant is easier to defend just because he's not in motion. I think that's a cop out. The aren't many players in the league you want more than you want Dez Bryant coming off the line to beat press coverage who have the speed and the play making ability on the ball to beat CBs downfield and the quickness to beat them inside off the snap. I think you've been listening to Bryan Broaddus too much. They moved Dez around the lineup yesterday. He didn't beat his coverage. And the plays were there to be made. Re-watch them.

Also for the record, I'm dubious that you have any idea what level of involvement the HC has in how Dez gets used from game to game. I think you're guessing, because you want something else to complain about.

The one constant has been Garrett. And if he's not building the game plans he's still responsible for them. He's the head coach. If he has an issue with Linehan and how he is using Bryant he can simply walk down to his office and tell him what he wants.

Equally strange is this idea that it's too difficult to move Bryant around. That he has to play outside all the time. Somehow, some way Atlanta moves Jones around. AJ Green plays out of the slot from time to time too.

My complaining about Garrett is offset by your constant excuse making for him.

 

[rynochop]

Can't for Romos return. Bottom line

 

[MRV52]

The offense has all the pieces you would need to succeed in the NFL.

A diverse group of WRs with different skillsets, a reliable safety valve TE that converts third downs, two very good multipurpose 3 down backs, heck they even have an X-factor type back with Dunbar.

All behind the best OL in the league.

Yet we end up looking like this most games:

Lol as a kid I had that game. Damn that is a long time ago.

 

[StarBoyz83]

Did garret see any issues with himself costing Dallas a another game?

 

[Idgit]

The one constant has been Garrett. And if he's not building the game plans he's still responsible for them. He's the head coach. If he has an issue with Linehan and how he is using Bryant he can simply walk down to his office and tell him what he wants.

Equally lame is this idea that it's too tough to move Bryant around. That he has to play outside all the time. Somehow, some way Atlanta moves Jones around. AJ Green plays out of the slot from time to time too.

More lame than either is you simply ignoring the questions. Nobody said it was too tough to move Bryant around. I actually saw them move Bryant around. I said I don't have a problem with them not doing it more because he had plays to make where he was and he didn't make them.

You heard Brian Broaddus say we need to put Dez in motion and now that's supposed to be a criticism of the offense. I'm saying for $10M a year, how 'bout he just come down with the contested footballs and we stop making excuses for the insufficient production? He had one catch. For 8 yards yesterday, in support of a rookie QB we needed to protect. And you're *****ing about the HC not flanking him or putting him in the slot more than they did already. It's a cop-out. When the ball hits your hands, you catch it. You catch the ones that hit your hands, you get more balls that hit your hands. You don't catch the ones that hit your hands, then nobody gets to complain they didn't try to hit your hands from another place on the field or hit your hands when you're in motion first.

 

[Sydla]

More lame than either is you simply ignoring the questions. Nobody said it was too tough to move Bryant around. I actually saw them move Bryant around. I said I don't have a problem with them not doing it more because he had plays to make where he was and he didn't make them.

You heard Brian Broaddus say we need to put Dez in motion and now that's supposed to be a criticism of the offense. I'm saying for $10M a year, how 'bout he just come down with the contested footballs and we stop making excuses for the insufficient production? He had one catch. For 8 yards yesterday, in support of a rookie QB we needed to protect. And you're *****ing about the HC not flanking him or putting him in the slot more than they did already. It's a cop-out. When the ball hits your hands, you catch it. You catch the ones that hit your hands, you get more balls that hit your hands. You don't catch the ones that hit your hands, then nobody gets to complain they didn't try to hit your hands from another place on the field or hit your hands when you're in motion first.

Actually you kind of did in another thread. You seemed to think it is too difficult given our personnel and how ineffective it would be.

"He's the X and apparently we don't have another X except Butler who needs another year or two of seasoning to play it well. You CANNOT interchange the X and Z like some of you seem to think; and certainly not the S Putting Dez in motion means moving him presnap off the LOS and someone else on it. Those routes are the S as well as the RBs and Y at times. Today they covered the outside and deep. That takes away the X but leaves the S and Y open. Beasley needs to make the most of his looks. There is a reason Beasley looks like a S and Dez a X."

And no, it's not just Broaddus. It's been pointed out by a lot of people that the team doesn't use Bryant in the same ways other teams use their elite WRs. That Dallas pretty much uses him solely on the outside.

 

[superonyx]

The Saints and Steelers are more talented than we are, I think, even with Tony in the huddle. It's a lot closer with Tony in there, though. I always break offensive production down to look at the points/offensive series since it nets out possession variances and defensive and ST scores. It's a stat where we perform well relative to the rest of the league with Tony in the lineup, at least.

And we would have performed well there yesterday, too, if Dez had held onto his ball and if Beasley had held onto his. And then nobody would be talking about putting Dez in motion more or whatever it is today.

I'm sorry, but watching where Dak went with the ball yesterday, I just don't have a problem with his decisions. The guys were open, and most of them were catching it better than Dez did. If it weren't for the blatant drops, or the jailbreaks on Free or the holding penalties putting us in low-percentage situations, we were playing smart football. People see the final score and conclude 'we need to put Dez in motion' or 'Dez needs to run more slants.' The reality--I think--is out interior OL needed to block better without holding. Free needed to counter the inside move better. And the guys we did throw to needed to come down with the footballs that they got their hands on. Or they just need to get out of bounds for us to take the shot at the GW kick.

I don't see the need to complicate it any more than that. And I think those fundamentals come down to coaching, too. Either coach them to hold onto the ball and to get out of bounds, or coach them from the bench and put somebody else in the lineup. Just make the damn plays that are there to be made and let's not pretend that, if Dez were just in motion, he's going to make that catch he didn't make in the first place.

Based on the formations and play calling I don't have a problem with Daks throws and decisions at all. But this is based on what options were available.
Where we differ is that I believe we need to create scenarios where instead of Cole or Witten being the best option its Dez Bryant. I am not saying Dez would have caught that ball if he was in motion. I am saying that if we moved him around and sent him in motion ect then he would have had more options to catch more balls. Its not a good thing when the large majority of your targets are Witten and Cole Beasley. But again I don't blame Dak for taking what was open and available. In fact I would blame him if he didn't. Its the coaches that need to make sure that the guy who is the best target is the guy who is the most explosive and most likely to score.

I was just watching the Steelers Skins game and watching how Antonio Brown is moving around and keeping from have Norman and a guy over the top on him is impressive. The guy catches 130 balls per year and if they did to him what we do with Dez he wouldn't be half as effective. He would be like Desean Jackson level. He is very talented no doubt. But his system is perfect for making sure he cant be completely taken out of a game.

So we agree about Daks decisions. You just prefer to take what is given and keep everyone where they are and hope we can consistently beat defenses with Witten and Cole. I prefer to move our most explosive playmaker around so he can create mismatches and make it much harder for the defense to remove him from our gameplan.

 

[vlad]

Has Garrett ever once taken the blame for anything? Has he ever said "I need to do better as a coach" beyond generic statements like "We all need to do our jobs" or something along those lines? I hear a lot of other coaches, every Sunday, putting the onus on themselves after a lackluster performance.

Not once that I can recall. I believe that was Callahan's big statement about him on his way out the door. I remember him just throwing him under the bus about play calling once.

 

[vlad]

Actually you kind of did in another thread. You seemed to think it is too difficult given our personnel and how ineffective it would be.

"He's the X and apparently we don't have another X except Butler who needs another year or two of seasoning to play it well. You CANNOT interchange the X and Z like some of you seem to think; and certainly not the S Putting Dez in motion means moving him presnap off the LOS and someone else on it. Those routes are the S as well as the RBs and Y at times. Today they covered the outside and deep. That takes away the X but leaves the S and Y open. Beasley needs to make the most of his looks. There is a reason Beasley looks like a S and Dez a X."

And no, it's not just Broaddus. It's been pointed out by a lot of people that the team doesn't use Bryant in the same ways other teams use their elite WRs. That Dallas pretty much uses him solely on the outside.

They did the same thing when TO was here - I remember so many people questioning why they never ran crossing routes with him since he was so great at them previously in his career. But JG believes in the system more than his players, so the players must adapt (it seems)

 

[Idgit]

Actually you kind of did in another thread. You seemed to think it is too difficult given our personnel and how ineffective it would be.

"He's the X and apparently we don't have another X except Butler who needs another year or two of seasoning to play it well. You CANNOT interchange the X and Z like some of you seem to think; and certainly not the S Putting Dez in motion means moving him presnap off the LOS and someone else on it. Those routes are the S as well as the RBs and Y at times. Today they covered the outside and deep. That takes away the X but leaves the S and Y open. Beasley needs to make the most of his looks. There is a reason Beasley looks like a S and Dez a X."

And no, it's not just Broaddus. It's been pointed out by a lot of people that the team doesn't use Bryant in the same ways other teams use their elite WRs. That Dallas pretty much uses him solely on the outside.

Do you think I'm jobber right now?

http://cowboyszone.com/threads/cowboys-vs-giants-post-game-thread.356294/page-20#post-6809254

 

[reddyuta]

Is this any surprising? .an orange idiot has fooled half the country .all Garrett has done is to fool the Jones family into thinking he is a genius.

 

[Idgit]

Based on the formations and play calling I don't have a problem with Daks throws and decisions at all. But this is based on what options were available.

Where we differ is that I believe we need to create scenarios where instead of Cole or Witten being the best option its Dez Bryant. I am not saying Dez would have caught that ball if he was in motion. I am saying that if we moved him around and sent him in motion ect then he would have had more options to catch more balls. Its not a good thing when the large majority of your targets are Witten and Cole Beasley. But again I don't blame Dak for taking what was open and available. In fact I would blame him if he didn't. Its the coaches that need to make sure that the guy who is the best target is the guy who is the most explosive and most likely to score.

I was just watching the Steelers Skins game and watching how Antonio Brown is moving around and keeping from have Norman and a guy over the top on him is impressive. The guy catches 130 balls per year and if they did to him what we do with Dez he wouldn't be half as effective. He would be like Desean Jackson level. He is very talented no doubt. But his system is perfect for making sure he cant be completely taken out of a game.

So we agree about Daks decisions. You just prefer to take what is given and keep everyone where they are and hope we can consistently beat defenses with Witten and Cole. I prefer to move our most explosive playmaker around so he can create mismatches and make it much harder for the defense to remove him from our gameplan.

Pretty much. I also don't think what we saw yesterday is indicative of what we'll see across the course of a season. We're definitely in agreement that we don't want Dez with 5 targets a game. And I can sort of see people wanting players to get looks commensurate with their compensation.

For my part, Dez has a huge impact on games whether or not he's getting the ball. If the QB thinks the better play is to put it elsewhere, I'm ok with that because I think Dez gets the nod plenty when it's all said and done. I just don't see going to bat for him to have more looks yesterday when, in my opinion, he didn't do enough with the looks he got.

 

[Idgit]

They did the same thing when TO was here - I remember so many people questioning why they never ran crossing routes with him since he was so great at them previously in his career. But JG believes in the system more than his players, so the players must adapt (it seems)

TO ran his share of slants here, too. And he was very effective in Dallas. Where does this stuff come from?

TO's problem was that he'd freelance and leave his QBs out to dry too often. But he offset that with huge plays because he was a phenom once you got him the ball.

 

[superonyx]

Pretty much. I also don't think what we saw yesterday is indicative of what we'll see across the course of a season. We're definitely in agreement that we don't want Dez with 5 targets a game. And I can sort of see people wanting players to get looks commensurate with their compensation.

For my part, Dez has a huge impact on games whether or not he's getting the ball. If the QB thinks the better play is to put it elsewhere, I'm ok with that because I think Dez gets the nod plenty when it's all said and done. I just don't see going to bat for him to have more looks yesterday when, in my opinion, he didn't do enough with the looks he got.

If we had more effective threats in other positions than Cole Beasley and T Will then the attention and double Dez brings would really be a weapon by itself. Unfortunately T Will disappears even under single coverage, and Cole amounts to a less injured less dangerous version of Lance Dunbar. We end up needing long 13 play drives where we need to convert multiple 3rd downs just to score...And then it ends in more FG's.

 

[Doomsday]

I saw Dez in the slot ONE time and it was on the play where he dropped the TD pass. He was one on one with a safety on that play as well. Seems like a match up you may want to try to exploit again.

I also dont buy the fact that the X is the X and guys like Butler, Williams and Beasley cant play it for 5 or 10 snaps a game. The Patriots and other teams have no problem moving WRs around, if nothing else you can throw Butler out there to occupy a defender so Dez can draw a favorable match up.

You see teams put RBs out there at times to see if teams will keep a CB on him, creating other mismatches on the inside. It is pretty common in modern NFL offenses, too bad JG is stuck in the 90s.