CFZ If we want serious playoff success, we can’t continue this

[Bobhaze]

Cowboys total accepted penalty numbers so far in 2023: 69 (tied for first)
Specific Penalties Called by number:

• False start: 10 times
• Delay of game: 3
• Offsides: 11
• Offensive holding: 10
• Defensive holding: 13
• Offensive PI: 1
• Defensive PI: 5
• Roughing the passer: 0
• Unnecessary roughness: 4
• Other- (facemask, illegal shift, illegal blocks, too many on the field, etc) 12

Source: https://www.footballdb.com/stats/penalties.html?sort=numpen

 

[Captain-Crash]

In order to be disciplined there has to be consequences to mistakes made. That is really the only way to limit mistakes.

if they make a penality, I think Jerry doesn't bring donuts to that guy in the locker room, the other guys still get theirs.

 

[Captain-Crash]

the defensive line lined up offsides the whole second half. I think only one or was it two ever called. shrugs. conspiracy, I tell you. smh

 

[CCBoy]

We cannot continue to be #1 in penalties . As of today, the Cowboys continue to lead the league in penalties averaging nearly 9 penalties a game. We are tied with Ariz with 69 accepted penalties but Ariz has done it in 10 games while the Cowboys have done it in 9. And it’s the pre-snap penalties that are the most egregious. We are second only to the hapless bears in pre-snap penalties. Over 1/3 of the called penalties are pre-snap. That’s not a ref conspiracy.

If we are serious about a deep playoff run, we can’t keep having these penalty problems, Why? In the last ten years, only one Super Bowl winner has finished even in the top 5 in penalties and that was Seattle in 2013. All nine other SB winners finished much lower in penalty numbers.

Here is how each SB winner the last decade finished in penalty rankings:

• 2013 Sea- finished 1st in penalty numbers
• 2014 NE- finished 6th in penalties.
• 2015 Den- finished 14th in penalties.
• 2016 NE- finished 31st in penalties.
• 2017- Filly- finished 13th in penalties.
• 2018- NE- finished 29th
• 2019- KC- finished 19th
• 2020- TB finished 27th
• 2021- LARams- finished 31st
• 2022- KC finished 28th.

Over the last decade of SB winners, the average penalty ranking for them was 19.9.
If the Cowboys are to be serious contenders in the playoffs, the penalty problems must be reduced.

That listing could also be used as a general indicator that is involved with top competitive teams as well.

 

[Bobhaze]

Just a question. What ARE pre-snap penalties? Formations? Motion? What else? Could they be called subjective? Ticky tack? Vague?

I certainly agree that penalties and championships don’t mix, but could there possibly be something “off” here?

Pre-snap penalties happen when the violation occurs before the snap.
Here are some pre-snap penalties

• False starts
• Delay of game
• Defensive neutral zone violation
• Lined up offside (enforced after the play)
• Too many men on the field (enforced after the play)
• Illegal substitution
• Illegal formation (enforced after play)
• Illegal motion (enforced after play)

 

[CCBoy]

curious - any idea what the packers teams were like when he was there? Was there the same penatly issue?

With six starters out of the roster and a #6 seed, he took his team to a Lombardi. Two starters out that very game as well.

 

[CowboysLakerBamaFan]

The league really needs to develop an AI officiating system. People are fallable, no matter how good they are at what they do. But if you think they can't get worse I implore you to recall the ref strike when the league brought in NCAA officials. What a disaster that was.

Maybe we could develop an AI-QB

 

[CowboysLakerBamaFan]

I’m referring to the eagles receiving 3 penalties for 56 yards in the last minute of play. Those were not on XP plays. They had 10 penalties for 98 yards in the game. I’m not familiar with what you are referring to ACF but youre welcome to disagree.

...and here come the "but THOSE penalties were OBVIOUS" replies

 

[CCBoy]

...and here come the "but THOSE penalties were OBVIOUS" replies

So? Does that insult you directly?

 

[Einstein]

We cannot continue to be #1 in penalties . As of today, the Cowboys continue to lead the league in penalties averaging nearly 9 penalties a game. We are tied with Ariz with 69 accepted penalties but Ariz has done it in 10 games while the Cowboys have done it in 9. And it’s the pre-snap penalties that are the most egregious. We are second only to the hapless bears in pre-snap penalties. Over 1/3 of the called penalties are pre-snap. That’s not a ref conspiracy.

If we are serious about a deep playoff run, we can’t keep having these penalty problems, Why? In the last ten years, only one Super Bowl winner has finished even in the top 5 in penalties and that was Seattle in 2013. All nine other SB winners finished much lower in penalty numbers.

Here is how each SB winner the last decade finished in penalty rankings:

• 2013 Sea- finished 1st in penalty numbers
• 2014 NE- finished 6th in penalties.
• 2015 Den- finished 14th in penalties.
• 2016 NE- finished 31st in penalties.
• 2017- Filly- finished 13th in penalties.
• 2018- NE- finished 29th
• 2019- KC- finished 19th
• 2020- TB finished 27th
• 2021- LARams- finished 31st
• 2022- KC finished 28th.

Over the last decade of SB winners, the average penalty ranking for them was 19.9.
If the Cowboys are to be serious contenders in the playoffs, the penalty problems must be reduced.

While I don't disagree with the thought, honestly the stats make it look like being low in the penalties ranking isn't the end of the world.

 

[CowboysLakerBamaFan]

So? Does that insult you directly?

That.....doesn't even make sense. I wasn't talking to you

 

[ESisback]

With six starters out of the roster and a #6 seed, he took his team to a Lombardi. Two starters out that very game as well.

How? He was fat then too, wasn’t he?

That was a joke…

 

[CCBoy]

That.....doesn't even make sense. I wasn't talking to you

You are hiding behind you were just insulting someone else...get real.

 

[CowboysLakerBamaFan]

You are hiding behind you were just insulting someone else...get real.

That's just not a real sentence. No offense...I just have no idea what you're saying

 

[TexasBoys2288]

I don't know in high school, we had guys serving as refs at practice and if you committed a penalty you were running the bleachers. Not sure if it is the answer for NFL players but try something. This has not changed in McCarthys tenure.

When I was playing football back in the day, the coaches found a pack of cigarettes in someone's locker. They made the whole team run the bleachers until the guy fessed up. No one ratted on him, he was one of our best players. They knew who it was all along, don't know why they made the whole team run the bleachers. Half the team smoked something or another and the other half was chewing or dipping, lol.

 

[The Fonz]

Penalties : undisciplined team = chaotic structure = country club

 

[kskboys]

I don’t off top of my head. I can look it up later. I do know McCarthy’s packers in 2010, the year they won the SB had a ton of injuries, especially at OL and won it anyway.

Yup. Due specifically to their DT play. Raji alone caused 2 picks, one of them a pick 6.

 

[DripTooHard]

The league really needs to develop an AI officiating system. People are fallable, no matter how good they are at what they do. But if you think they can't get worse I implore you to recall the ref strike when the league brought in NCAA officials. What a disaster that was.

Incompetent refs and biased officiating are instruments the NFL has to manage the flow of the game. Not saying they rig games but I do believe they make and don’t make certain calls to manage the flow of the game to keep viewership as high as possible.

 

[KJJ]

curious - any idea what the packers teams were like when he was there? Was there the same penatly issue?

We had penalty issues under Garrett. Being an undisciplined team over the years is part of the reason why the Cowboys can never get over the hump.

 

[gimmesix]

Pre-snap penalties are not arbitrary. We have 26 pre-snap penalties including a league leading 11 penalties for simply lining up off sides. There’s nothing arbitrary about that or the 10 false starts, or delay of game calls.

Yes holding calls on O or D can be arbitrary, but there are 9 teams in the league with more offensive holding calls than us. We lead the league in defensive holding calls with 13, but there are 8 other teams that have 10-12.

And if the argument is “They never call the other team”, the Cowboys are 4th in the league in beneficiary calls, meaning they have had quite a few calls go their way. The recent eagles game is a prime example.

I agree with the lining up offsides penalty. That one should not be happening. Same with the false starts.