Interesting Julius Jones news

[theogt]

If I'm running a 2 RB offense - instead of one workhorse - I'd rather have Drew. He's more of a home run threat and he can return kicks.

Well, I wouldn't run a 2 RB offense. I'd have a change of pace back, but he wouldn't get nearly as much play as Barber does.

 

[Rack]

Well, I wouldn't run a 2 RB offense. I'd have a change of pace back, but he wouldn't get nearly as much play as Barber does.

I like the way our backs are rotated, I just wish JuJo was more effective.


It makes it very tough on a defense late in the season (and the playoffs) when they have to 1) gameplan for 2 different styles of runners, and 2) play against two different style runners that are both fresh.


Addai is solid, but he won't be a superstar if he has to carry the load.

 

[theogt]

And just why wouldn't he be a superstar if he has to carry the load? Are you psychic, Rack? I've long thought you were, but I want direct confirmation.

 

[Idgit]

Forget Addai and Maroney, how awesome would it be to have Maurice Drew splitting carries with MBIII?


And Drew is a darn good return man too.


What round was Drew drafted? That's the round we need to take a shot at a RB. It has to be a shifty type RB, not another bruiser.

*This* would have been an excellent fit, in retrospect. Especially if the 2nd rounder for Julius was really on the table.

 

[Rack]

And just why wouldn't he be a superstar if he has to carry the load? Are you psychic, Rack? I've long thought you were, but I want direct confirmation.

O-P-I-N-I-O-N


Still, it's more difficult for a defense to prepare for TWO good RBs with different styles, then to prepare for 1 workhorse.

Of course anyone would rather have an LT, but there's maybe 2 or 3 other RBs in the entire NFL that are close to being in his neighborhood as far as talent. Those types of RBs don't come around often.


So until that RB shows up in Dallas, I'll take the 2 RB approach. Preferably with different running styles.

 

[the kid 05]

It has not been average around here, I still have flashbacks to T-Ham tripping over invisible gophers:laugh1:

dude they were there! i saw them....:

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Sounds like message board garbage to me.

What i really wonder is if Thompson would have gotten some carries if Jones still didnt avoid the pile.

 

[AdamJT13]

So what you're saying is that Parcells is calling different running plays for Julius and Marion

The vast majority of their carries are in different situations. Julius gets most of his carries on first and second downs, usually in long-yardage situations. Barber gets most of his carries in passing situations, short-yardage situations and in the red zone. There are only a few possessions per game -- sometimes none -- when Barber begins a drive that starts on our end of the field. And it's rare when Julius gets carries on third-and-short or inside the 10.

So the answer is yes, they get the ball on different plays, in different situations. They each have their role, and for the most part, they don't get a lot of work in the other player's role.

Just a few examples of the types of carries they've gotten --

FROM FOUR-WR FORMATIONS
Jones 5 out of 247 carries (2.0 percent)
Barber 10 out of 122 carries (8.2 percent)

FROM THREE-WR FORMATIONS
Jones 47 out of 247 (19.0 percent)
Barber 30 out of 122 (24.6 percent)

ON THIRD OR FOURTH DOWN
Jones 3 carries (all 3 converted)
Barber 32 carries (15 converted)

ON THIRD-AND-6 TO 10
Jones 0 carries
Barber 5 carries

ON THIRD-AND-11 OR MORE
Jones 0 carries
Barber 7 carries

ON FIRST-AND-10
Jones 150 out of 247 (60.7 percent)
Barber 44 out of 122 (36.1 percent)

INSIDE OWN 40
Jones 80 out of 247 (32.4 percent)
Barber 25 out of 122 (20.5 percent)

INSIDE RED ZONE
Jones 45 out of 247 (18.2 percent)
Barber 46 out of 122 (37.7 percent)

WHEN AHEAD BY 22+ POINTS
Jones 0 carries
Barber 11 carries

AGAINST DEFENSIVE BLITZ
Jones 29 carries
Barber 10 carries

IN FINAL TWO MINUTES OF HALF/GAME
Jones 2 carries
Barber 15 carries

IN FIRST QUARTER
Jones 74 carries
Barber 8 carries

As you can see, the way they're used and the types of carries they get are vastly different.

 

[Rack]

IN FINAL TWO MINUTES OF HALF/GAME
Jones 2 carries
Barber 15 carries

That right there says a lot to me.



And for everyone that claims Barber's YPC is inflated cuz of his carries on 3rd and long, well, he's also our short yardage/goalline RB, so that lowers his YPC.


In the end you don't even have to look at the stats, although that was a very detailed breakdown by Adam. You just have to watch them play. You can see who the better run is.

JuJo will hit a homerun every now and then, but like most homerun hitters, he's also gonna strike out a lot.

The tandem is already very good, but it was be well into "great" if JuJo had better vision. And some of the holes he misses aren't even way off from where he ends up... One step to the right or left, and he's got a big run. Sometimes he gets it, most of the time he doesn't.

He was doing a solid job of consistently reading the hole early in the season, but I guess at that point he wasn't listening to Parcells, and then all the sudden he did start to listen to Parcells and it effected his running?




Let's just hope both RBs pick up their game in the playoffs cuz we're gonna need it (as well as everyone else on the team).

 

[Sarge]

Every year there are 20+ running backs that reach 1000 yards. That's pretty average.

BINGO - we have a winner. 1000 yards a season averages 62.5 yards per game...........big deal.

 

[Bryan8284]

We wouldn't trade Julius as it leaves us with no 2nd back in Parcells beloved two back system.

A 2nd? Doubt it

Unless we intend to sign a RB or draft one high to help Barber.

 

[CrazyCowboy]

I could see this happening .....really, but, we will have to wait and see.

 

[rynochop]

We wouldn't trade Julius as it leaves us with no 2nd back in Parcells beloved two back system.

A 2nd? Doubt it

Unless we intend to sign a RB or draft one high to help Barber.

As someone else mentioned. Why would we draft a RB to replace him, when we can just keep him?

It's not as if multiple 1000 yd backs are just waiting to be drafted out there.

If you can get a 1st rounder for him thats one thing, maybe Tyson Thompson comes back next season as a backup.

 

[dwmyers]

I don't think the fact that Parcell's running backs in the past have had average (or in some of the cases you pointed out below average) seasons, means anything really.

It's so persistent I think it does. What I believe happens is he runs his starting running backs into defenses that expect it, knowing they aren't going to get diddly, simply for time of possession purposes.

Even then, he expects 2-3 yards from his starter. It's one reason he's so adamant about hanging onto the ball and so determined that his runners never lose yards.

In the 4th quarter, if Parcells has been playing his way, he wears the opposing teams out. So, Barber has the advantage of a tired defense to run against. The fact almost all secondary backs have a higher average (it isn't just Barber) suggests his use of secondary backs tends to this kind of trend.

Let's be plain spoken. I don't think Curtis Martin is a career 3.5 ypc back. But I do think he is IN THE HANDS OF A BILL PARCELLS. And Ottis Anderson isn't a cheesehead back either.

The only back who has performed better than JJ is performing now is Joe Morris, and Bill thinks (and analysis by "Pro Football Prospectus 2006" shows) that he ruined Joe Morris by overrunning him.

David.

 

[Alexander]

It's so persistent I think it does. What I believe happens is he runs his starting running backs into defenses that expect it, knowing they aren't going to get diddly, simply for time of possession purposes.

So he intentionally tries to gain less yards because it milks the clock?

That is the most absurd theory I have ever heard.

Whether you run it on first or second down, it still runs the clock. He runs on first down simply because that is his tendency and his preference. And since the early downs are running downs, that average is going to be uniform for the same coach.

Most coaches play the time of possession game, Coach Parcells is no different.

 

[jrockster77]

Every day I'm thankful that Parcells passed on Steven Jackson and took JJ.

 

[dwmyers]

That's an outstanding analysis David.

Bill could give a crap about the fantasy stats that everyone is crowing about.

That's true. It's all about time of possession, baby. The other stat of note is, in terms of total YPC, this team is 13th out of 32. There have only been 3 teams in Parcells history that were better (2 being the 1985-1986 Joe Morris teams mentioned earlier), and we're out complaining about how badly we run?

Typical of a Parcells team is to be about 20-25th in the league in total YPC. This isn't a very typical Parcells team, and a lot of this talk takes these rather dominant offensive stats for granted.

url: http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/ParcBi0.htm

 

[superpunk]

It's so persistent I think it does. What I believe happens is he runs his starting running backs into defenses that expect it, knowing they aren't going to get diddly, simply for time of possession purposes.

Even then, he expects 2-3 yards from his starter. It's one reason he's so adamant about hanging onto the ball and so determined that his runners never lose yards.

In the 4th quarter, if Parcells has been playing his way, he wears the opposing teams out. So, Barber has the advantage of a tired defense to run against. The fact almost all secondary backs have a higher average (it isn't just Barber) suggests his use of secondary backs tends to this kind of trend.

Let's be plain spoken. I don't think Curtis Martin is a career 3.5 ypc back. But I do think he is IN THE HANDS OF A BILL PARCELLS. And Ottis Anderson isn't a cheesehead back either.

The only back who has performed better than JJ is performing now is Joe Morris, and Bill thinks (and analysis by "Pro Football Prospectus 2006" shows) that he ruined Joe Morris by overrunning him.

David.

I bought the typical Parcells stuff for a while, and he really does stress not losing yardage. Julius does that, even if there's not much there, he's not getting caught in the backfield that often. But there is a problem with Julius, now. If there is a lane to the outside, he can't see it or get there. If he does, an arm-tackle is enough to bring him down. If there's a huge cutback lane, he can't see it or get there, if he does....rinse and repeat. Parcells is not coaching him to do that. Parcells is coaching him to do what he did in this year's first 5 or so games. Not the woefully sub-par (even for a Parcells back) performance we've seen the last 9 games.

 

[Rampage]

trade him. but i doubt anybody would give up a 2nd round pick for julius

 

[dwmyers]

So he intentionally tries to gain less yards because it milks the clock?

That is the most absurd theory I have ever heard.

Whether you run it on first or second down, it still runs the clock. He runs on first down simply because that is his tendency and his preference. And since the early downs are running downs, that average is going to be uniform for the same coach.

Most coaches play the time of possession game, Coach Parcells is no different.

There are a lot of professional cynics here. They offer no analysis of their own, they just yap like little dogs about things that bother them. Scoffing is an art form by some people, like you and theogt, and that's fine. It's what entertains you.

Just don't claim the running numbers support the assertion that JJ is an average back. I've posted numbers in this thread; it isn't the first time I have. I've been analyzing Parcells running backs since his first campaign, because it made no sense to me why the YPC numbers for a BP starter are so low, and the quality of running back so high.

If Curtis Martin were the starter and averaging 3.5, would you be calling him ordinary, too, and screaming for his head? Sorry to say, I think you would.

David.