La'el Collins Thread - Cleared post 767; visited Cowboys - 05/06/15

[Galian Beast]

No, not all the same. Some will be able to offer more up front money then others. Some will have no state tax implications. Some will offer better opportunity to start at certain positions. Some will offer better long term value. Some will offer more opportunity to make money away from Football. They will not all be the same.

Most of the states without income tax have higher taxes in other areas such as property tax.

I'm not saying all the teams are the same, but the amount of money offered will be the same and I don't think income tax will play a large role in his decision.
I think his priority will be starting immediately at right tackle and the team that can promise him that will likely get him to sign.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

If he's not the father of the baby and nothing else points to him then I could see teams more willing. But nobody wants to be the team that pays him over a million and he turns out to be involved in a murder. The team name being associated with him from now on.

I don't think that's a concern really. I mean, if he goes to jail, then he doesn't earn the full contract. Even if guaranteed. The money is guaranteed if the player shows up to play, regardless. However, it is not guaranteed if the player fails to show up. Then, it's void. Teams would only lose the signing bonus portion, which is caped. I don't think that would be too big of a deal honestly.

 

[perrykemp]

Biggest reason why Collins wouldn't sign with Dallas is that he wouldn't probably play in 2015 with Leary and Free still here.

If he goes and plays for another team and starts all 16 games (as you expect he would) he'd earn upwards of $400,000 extra from the NFL as part of the NFL's performance bonus system.

An example of this from last year is Green Bay's 5th round center Corey Linsely who ended up starting all 16 games for the Packers and ended up getting $340K more above and beyond his normal salary in NFL performance based bonuses from the NFL (not the Packers).

In order for Collins to be eligable for that bonus he would need to go to a team that he'd reasonably expect to start for in 2015.

$350K is a big deal to a UDFA.

Another example is Buffalo tackle Seantrel Henderson, who received $373,670 in NFL performance bonuses last year. He was drafted in the 7th round and started all 16 games last season.

The idea behind the program is it helps equalize and reward players drafted low and UDFAs who end up starting lots of games but don't have a way to earn a fair salary until that 3 or 4 year initial contract window is up.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Most of the states without income tax have higher taxes in other areas such as property tax.

I'm not saying all the teams are the same, but the amount of money offered will be the same and I don't think income tax will play a large role in his decision.
I think his priority will be starting immediately at right tackle and the team that can promise him that will likely get him to sign.

This is true but, a lot of players rent in those situations. They don't really buy until they can get a huge contract and really afford it. I think that's what a guy like Collins would do. He would rent a nice place until he got onto his second contract. Then, he would likely buy but that might not be in Dallas.

 

[Galian Beast]

Thanks for that but it is just my opinion. Anything could happen and until it does, it's just my opinion.

I think there will be no shortage of teams that will be willing to do that.

Already reports of teams showing interest, and team trying to get him will have to make the maximum offer, and that is obvious.

The money we are talking about here is less then What a lot of 3rd round picks get.

That is the simple nature of the limit on UDFA contracts.

How many 3rd rounders have we pissed away over the years?

We have generally traded away our 3rd round draft picks, and have missed on quite a few (though not recently)

The risk reward is too good to pass up IMO. I think there will be a lot of teams willing to do that. JMO

The risk vs reward is clear. You have the ability to get a 1st round quality player as an UDFA for a lot less money. Even guaranteeing his contract and then cutting him wouldn't significantly impact our salary cap, versus what he could offer us if he plays to his abilities. It is simple risk vs reward. And yes a lot of teams understand this.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I think there will be no shortage of teams that will be willing to do that.

Already reports of teams showing interest, and team trying to get him will have to make the maximum offer, and that is obvious.

The money we are talking about here is less then What a lot of 3rd round picks get.

That is the simple nature of the limit on UDFA contracts.

How many 3rd rounders have we pissed away over the years?

We have generally traded away our 3rd round draft picks, and have missed on quite a few (though not recently)

The risk reward is too good to pass up IMO. I think there will be a lot of teams willing to do that. JMO

The risk vs reward is clear. You have the ability to get a 1st round quality player as an UDFA for a lot less money. Even guaranteeing his contract and then cutting him wouldn't significantly impact our salary cap, versus what he could offer us if he plays to his abilities. It is simple risk vs reward. And yes a lot of teams understand this.

Yeah.

 

[Galian Beast]

Dolphins have a full court press on him, sending former LSU players to recruit him...

LOL we have Claiborne and Lavar Edwards... and Claiborne I'm guessing is too old to have even ever played with him...

They need to have our offensive line wine and dine him.

 

[speedkilz88]

 

[DBOY3141]

Dolphins have a full court press on him, sending former LSU players to recruit him...

LOL we have Claiborne and Lavar Edwards... and Claiborne I'm guessing is too old to have even ever played with him...

They need to have our offensive line wine and dine him.

If Dolphins could get him, they could reach the playoffs this year. Make or break year. Pouncy, James, Albert, Collins line to go with Parker, Landry, Stills, Jordan as receivers.

 

[perrykemp]

Agents will always tell a player to go to the team with the easiest access to a starter roll or a roster spot depending on their skill level.

Tony Romo himself said he looked around at teams and didn't look to see who their backup or starting QB was, but he looked at who their third quarterback was, so he had the best chance of making the team.

Playing time and money (both linked for players like this) play the largest role.

He has a chance to make as much as 75% more in 2015 if goes somewhere where he can start 16 games as opposed to sitting on the bench.

 

[Stash]

Maybe he can, maybe he can't. He isn't a guard and Leary has a lot of experience on him at this point, further ideally I'd like to see him at Rt and keep Leary where he is in case we re-sign him next year.

He's played 13 games at LG already during his sophomore year at LSU. How many has he played at RT?

I think Leary is a better LG than Free is a RT.

I'll disagree on that.

 

[Stash]

Agents will always tell a player to go to the team with the easiest access to a starter roll or a roster spot depending on their skill level.

Tony Romo himself said he looked around at teams and didn't look to see who their backup or starting QB was, but he looked at who their third quarterback was, so he had the best chance of making the team.

And again, he couldn't beat out undrafted free agent Ron Leary? A guy with bad knees that we think so much of we're offering minimum one year deals? I think Leary is a fine player but let's not confuse that with irreplaceable or beyond upgrading.

And would you rather play between Pro Bowlers or bums?

 

[xwalker]

Worth a shot late in the draft. Collins is really going to turn down money for a year? When he can come and potentially start for a superbowl contender? In a city close to home? Offer some imcemtives. That tackle we took in the 7th probably won't make the team anyway. In the 7th there really is no risk.

Last year Lewan was taken at #11. He got a contract for 4 years and about 12M. A 7th round pick will get about 2M in his first 4 years. That's 10M that he could gain by re-entering the draft.

 

[Stash]

If Free is healthy, he could not beat out Free by week one. He may not be able to beat out Free at all in his Rookie Season and if I had to bet, I would bet he could not.

Is Free healthy? I've read that he is not and likely wont be able to participate for some time.

 

[Galian Beast]

And again, he couldn't beat out undrafted free agent Ron Leary? A guy with bad knees that we think so much of we're offering minimum one year deals? I think Leary is a fine player but let's not confuse that with irreplaceable or beyond upgrading.

And would you rather play between Pro Bowlers or bums?

I heard Leary would have been a 3rd round draft pick if not for his medical concerns with his knees. The Cowboys are probably afraid to offer Leary something long term because of his knees, but that doesn't mean a rookie would beat him out for this year.

 

[Galian Beast]

If Dolphins could get him, they could reach the playoffs this year. Make or break year. Pouncy, James, Albert, Collins line to go with Parker, Landry, Stills, Jordan as receivers.

I don't think we're going to be able to beat them... this sucks.

 

[Stash]

I heard Leary would have been a 3rd round draft pick if not for his medical concerns with his knees. The Cowboys are probably afraid to offer Leary something long term because of his knees, but that doesn't mean a rookie would beat him out for this year.

So Leary could have been a 3rd rounder, but has bad knees while Collins would have been a first rounder if not for something totally unrelated to football.

Collins' issues will be behind him while Leary's will be there forever.

But the reality of it all is that Collins would play between two young Pro Bowlers and would have to beat out an undrafted free agent on a one year contract to do it.

And as I said in the other post, Collins has 13 games worth of experience at LG already.

 

[speedkilz88]

Last year Lewan was taken at #11. He got a contract for 4 years and about 12M. A 7th round pick will get about 2M in his first 4 years. That's 10M that he could gain by re-entering the draft.

If he sat out a year I think he falls to at least the 2nd. I think the blue chippers that actually played that year last until early 2nd and from that point he could be taken.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Is Free healthy? I've read that he is not and likely wont be able to participate for some time.

Right now, I believe he is still rehabbing but I believe he is scheduled to be healthy by TC.

 

[Nightman]

So Leary could have been a 3rd rounder, but has bad knees while Collins would have been a first rounder if not for something totally unrelated to football.

Collins' issues will be behind him while Leary's will be there forever.

But the reality of it all is that Collins would play between two young Pro Bowlers and would have to beat out an undrafted free agent on a one year contract to do it.

And as I said in the other post, Collins has 13 games worth of experience at LG already.

Leary doesn't have bad knees. He has a condition that if he gets injured he may never recover from it.

Collins would be no sure thing to beat out Leary or Free, continuity is huge for an OL