Mike Mayocks last Mock just went live

[Stash]

That's also why players who have the skill sets and the "POTENTIAL" to be coached and want to be coached along with the heart and determination to succeed and become better players or pass rushers are drafted higher then people sitting at home want them to be drafted.

'POTENTIAL' at #14 overall.

Not thanks, give me 'PRODUCTION' at #14.

And I can't just let it pass when the team makes what I feel is an obviously dumb move.

I couldn't do it in 2009 either, sue me!

 

[btcutter]

By this logic Smith would not have been drafted by us last year.

Not really. Smith played very well at his tackle postion. The only question was can he play LT. We gotten a proven commodity at RT.

Brocker...not so much.

Also we are talking about pass rush skill sets. This isn't exactly something that can be easily taught or learned. Some guys just "have it" some never get it despite having all the "tools". That's what I worry about regarding Brocker.

If we are taking Brocker then I think might as well take Poe who has even bigger upside than Brocker. You gonna go boom or bust then go with Poe.

 

[btcutter]

'POTENTIAL' at #14 overall.

Not thanks, give me 'PRODUCTION' at #14.

And I can't just let it pass when the team makes what I feel is an obviously dumb move.

I couldn't do it in 2009 either, sue me!

Here, here.... I hate the word "potential"...just means that he hasn't done "jack".

 

[jterrell]

I don't get the love for Brockers.

Great run stuffing DE that's young with "POTENTIAL".

What our DL needs is a pass rushing DE that can also play the run. It's easier to teach defending the run as it's more of a willingness to do it but it's hard to teach pass rush. That's why every team is looking for a pass rusher every year.

I am not too keen on taking Brockers at 14.

Brockers is a Texas kid who who weighs 322 pounds and carries it well. He isn't a 240 pound pass rushing demon but he bats aside OL that the 240 pound guys have to run away from.

At the next level you need guys who can win one on one match ups. Size is more important in the NFL than in college where big guys can be doubled and ran away from.

Brockers reminds a lot of scouts of Haloti Ngata who is a much better player in the NFL than he was in college. When analysts say they think Brockers won't be a pass rusher they target him with 4-6 sacks. Think about that for a second. Better pass rusher than Jason Hatcher and better run stuffer than even Kenyon Coleman. That's why there is legit interest in Brockers.

As hard as it is to admit for fans apparently our DL is where we have the least amount of true NFL talent. We have a bunch of back up caliber guys and Jay Ratliff. Brockers selection allows us to cut Coleman and rotate the DL with more size and more talent.

 

[DFWJC]

'POTENTIAL' at #14 overall.

Not thanks, give me 'PRODUCTION' at #14.

And I can't just let it pass when the team makes what I feel is an obviously dumb move.

I couldn't do it in 2009 either, sue me!

I hear ya Stash. But potential worked pretty well at 14 for the Giants two seasons ago. I think there's a balance to be had.

 

[Miller]

Not really. Smith played very well at his tackle postion. The only question was can he play LT. We gotten a proven commodity at RT.

Brocker...not so much.

Also we are talking about pass rush skill sets. This isn't exactly something that can be easily taught or learned. Some guys just "have it" some never get it despite having all the "tools". That's what I worry about regarding Brocker.

If we are taking Brocker then I think might as well take Poe who has even bigger upside than Brocker. You gonna go boom or bust then go with Poe.

Another thing is I've seen multiple scout reports, including Mayocks, that mention him being better suited for a 4-3 type D. He would probably be a DE in our 3-4 or would be better suited for that.

 

[jterrell]

Here, here.... I hate the word "potential"...just means that he hasn't done "jack".

You mean other than start on an LSU defense that beat Bama at home, won the SEC and played for a national championship.


LOL. I love how you describe not doing jack.

 

[btcutter]

Brockers is a Texas kid who who weighs 322 pounds and carries it well. He isn't a 240 pound pass rushing demon but he bats aside OL that the 240 pound guys have to run away from.

At the next level you need guys who can win one on one match ups. Size is more important in the NFL than in college where big guys can be doubled and ran away from.

Brockers reminds a lot of scouts of Haloti Ngata who is a much better player in the NFL than he was in college. When analysts say they think Brockers won't be a pass rusher they target him with 4-6 sacks. Think about that for a second. Better pass rusher than Jason Hatcher and better run stuffer than even Kenyon Coleman. That's why there is legit interest in Brockers.

As hard as it is to admit for fans apparently our DL is where we have the least amount of true NFL talent. We have a bunch of back up caliber guys and Jay Ratliff. Brockers selection allows us to cut Coleman and rotate the DL with more size and more talent.

If we are going on POTENTIAL then I'll take Poe instead. I am going for broke if I am picking between two potential guys.

Poe played with nobodies while Brocker played with basically a semi pro team with talent. I think Poe's got more upside.

 

[jswalker1981]

If Brockers is our pick I hope the scouts are right and he's a stud.

Right now, I see nothing more than using a 14th pick on a glorified two down run stuffer.

One year ago:

Right now, I see nothing more than using a 9th pick on a glorified right tackle.

And I'm not saying you said that Dash, I'm just saying that last year there were some that didn't want to draft a guy that "wasn't even a left tackle in college" with the 9th pick. Brockers is only 21, I'll give the benefit of the doubt before I go ahead and label him a bust.

 

[jterrell]

Not really. Smith played very well at his tackle postion. The only question was can he play LT. We gotten a proven commodity at RT.

Brocker...not so much.

Also we are talking about pass rush skill sets. This isn't exactly something that can be easily taught or learned. Some guys just "have it" some never get it despite having all the "tools". That's what I worry about regarding Brocker.

If we are taking Brocker then I think might as well take Poe who has even bigger upside than Brocker. You gonna go boom or bust then go with Poe.

1. You don't draft RTs at 9.
2. You don't draft 21 year olds based on past performance.

Tyron was a physical freak who was better last year than in his final season in college. He will get only get better. Brockers is in that same mold. You want ot draft guys that cna play but also have upside and development ahead of them.

Brockers is immediately our best DE and best run stuffer across the DL. He will only get better. Sophomores who start at LSU are going to be high draft picks.

He isn't a sexy pick but by far a better value pick than DeCastro pr Barron IMHO.

 

[btcutter]

You mean other than start on an LSU defense that beat Bama at home, won the SEC and played for a national championship.


LOL. I love how you describe not doing jack.

Yeah and exactly how did Spear and Dorsey do? In fact those two STARRED when they played on those teams too.
People want to down grade Coples who has twice as much production but call him lazy but wants a guy completely based on potential just because he is young and strong? don't get it.

 

[honyock]

That's disappointing, I had wanted Brockers, I have never liked the way that Bockers has played and is a big reach.

Also not wild an Bockers. Rather have DeCasto, Baon, or even Gilmoe. Not sure about Kikpatick. He'd be a eal each.

 

[jterrell]

If we are going on POTENTIAL then I'll take Poe instead. I am going for broke if I am picking between two potential guys.

Poe played with nobodies while Brocker played with basically a semi pro team with talent. I think Poe's got more upside.

You keep making this hilariously incorrect assumption Brockers was bad on tape. He wasn't. He lived in back fields. He didn't rack up sacks but 320+ pound guys almost never do.

Brockers beat out semi-pro level players for his starting gig at LSU.

Where is all this tape of Brockers playing poorly?

 

[jterrell]

Yeah and exactly how did Spear and Dorsey do? In fact those two STARRED when they played on those teams too.
People want to down grade Coples who has twice as much production but call him lazy but wants a guy completely based on potential just because he is young and strong? don't get it.

Yes, they did. And each had maxed out at the college level.
Neither had any room for improvement in the pros.

Brockers has added 60 pounds in 2+ years and is only 3 years out of high school. Had Brockers stayed another year he'd be Dorsey or Spears and drafted top 10 except he'd have rare NFL measurables to match SEC dominance.

You are entitled to like or not like anyone but the specifics of your arguments are pretty weak.

Upshaw or Hightower are much more like Dorsey and Spears. Veterans on great defenses that dominated and knew the schemes like the backs of their hands but showed athleticism concerns in post-season workouts.

Brockers can be a NT or a DE here. He is that athletic and big. His best work is his most recent.

 

[Stash]

I hear ya Stash. But potential worked pretty well at 14 for the Giants two seasons ago. I think there's a balance to be had.

I wouldn't compare Brockers to JPP myself.

JPP lacked experience but showed he could get there.

Brockers has not.

 

[visionary]

Brockers is a Texas kid who who weighs 322 pounds and carries it well. He isn't a 240 pound pass rushing demon but he bats aside OL that the 240 pound guys have to run away from.

At the next level you need guys who can win one on one match ups. Size is more important in the NFL than in college where big guys can be doubled and ran away from.

Brockers reminds a lot of scouts of Haloti Ngata who is a much better player in the NFL than he was in college. When analysts say they think Brockers won't be a pass rusher they target him with 4-6 sacks. Think about that for a second. Better pass rusher than Jason Hatcher and better run stuffer than even Kenyon Coleman. That's why there is legit interest in Brockers.

As hard as it is to admit for fans apparently our DL is where we have the least amount of true NFL talent. We have a bunch of back up caliber guys and Jay Ratliff. Brockers selection allows us to cut Coleman and rotate the DL with more size and more talent.

great points
if he is our pick so be it

he certainly has the potential to have a significant impact on our defense

i have grown to hoping for barron only because it seems he will be very very good and there are much better DE options in rd 2 and 3 and no S options

 

[Stash]

You mean other than start on an LSU defense that beat Bama at home, won the SEC and played for a national championship.


LOL. I love how you describe not doing jack.

Again with the 'one man is an island' thinking.

Larry Allen couldn't do it by himself yesterday, but Brockers apparently won the National Championship by himself today!

 

[Dwight]

You don't draft a player with the 14th pick due to his Potential. That is such a risk. Trade down if Barron and Cox are not there. Decastro still may be there in the late teens. He was productive in college. Atleast consider selecting him. The player I remember Dallas selecting who had potential was Bennett. Review how that ended. Dallas has to learn from their history.

 

[texbumthelife]

You don't draft a player with the 14th pick due to his Potential. That is such a risk. Trade down if Barron and Cox are not there. Decastro still may be there in the late teens. He was productive in college. Atleast consider selecting him. The player I remember Dallas selecting who had potential was Bennett.

Everyone is getting drafted based on potential.

 

[Sasquatch]

I'm not wedded to any one player in this draft and would be content with most of the names floated for the first round selection, but why would the Chiefs choose Barron? Their run defense was atrocious, they lost a starting CB, and their OL needs work as well. What's the logic here, strictly BPA?