Mincey holding out

[Stash]

That's fine. I'm sure he wasn't facing the type of blocking that JPP was, though.

I'm all ears if you want to try to prove your case.

He's a JAG, but I'm not going to release him to prove a point, either. More reps for Gardner & Russell!

He's hardly a JAG. In fact, he was our best "guy" on the line last year and I'm not so soon forgetting that for two guys who have never taken an NFL snap.

 

[Hoofbite]

He was the best "bum" we had on the defensive line last year.

And? Will he be the best this year? How about 2nd or 3rd best?

It's not because he's outstanding that he was the best so being the best isn't something that amounts to much.

Like winning a beauty pageant when all the contestents have been hardcore meth users for over a decade.

 

[Primetime42]

I'm all ears if you want to try to prove your case.



He's hardly a JAG. In fact, he was our best "guy" on the line last year and I'm not so soon forgetting that for two guys who have never taken an NFL snap.

Put both guys on the market and see who gets more money thrown at them, even down a digit.

Yes, he's a JAG. Being our best last year isn't exactly saying a whole lot. Aside from Crawford, Melton in small flashes, and Lawrence at the end of the season, nobody really played well at all.

 

[Stash]

And? Will he be the best this year? How about 2nd or 3rd best?

What about 70th best - as in where he's being paid? He's at least the 2nd best until one of the young guys proves otherwise.

It's not because he's outstanding that he was the best so being the best isn't something that amounts to much.

His numbers I quoted earlier against JPP's weren't a result of being the 'best of the worst'. They showed what a factor the player actually was.

Like winning a beauty pageant when all the contestents have been hardcore meth users for over a decade.

His numbers are his numbers. If he's trash, everyone else is only worse.

 

[jday]

Yeah, he deserves a raise.

Here's the deal - I deserve a raise and I'm probably not going to get it because like him, I presently have no leverage. That's the reality of his situation. Though I very well could be wrong in regards to the leverage he has. But from the outside looking in, he and I are in the same boat....

 

[Stash]

Put both guys on the market and see who gets more money thrown at them, even down a digit.

As if that proves a thing?

Yes, he's a JAG. Being our best last year isn't exactly saying a whole lot. Aside from Crawford, Melton in small flashes, and Lawrence at the end of the season, nobody really played well at all.

Except Mincey. As the numbers clearly show. You know, the ones you continue to try to gloss over.

 

[Stash]

Here's the deal - I deserve a raise and I'm probably not going to get it because like him, I presently have no leverage. That's the reality of his situation. Though I very well could be wrong in regards to the leverage he has. But from the outside looking in, he and I are in the same boat....

Are you under contract to your employer or can you freely seek out another job?

 

[speedkilz88]

JAG is always misused. What he is, is a journeyman.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I wish Hayden would hold-out.

 

[Hoofbite]

What about 70th best - as in where he's being paid? He's at least the 2nd best until one of the young guys proves otherwise.

His numbers I quoted earlier against JPP's weren't a result of being the 'best of the worst'. They showed what a factor the player actually was.

His numbers are his numbers. If he's trash, everyone else is only worse.

Hurries are an empty stat. One guy has twice as many sacks as the other. Comparison ends there.

The team's success is not bound to a guy who had 6 sacks.

 

[Doomsday101]

I wish Hayden would hold-out.

His last year under contract, soon he will not be here to be kicked around any longer. I know the guy is a JAG but he hustle and does what he is asked and that I like about him.

 

[Stash]

Hurries are an empty stat. One guy has twice as many sacks as the other. Comparison ends there.

For you maybe. I guess we should throw out all of those stories about pass rush helping a secondary then?

After all, it's sacks or nothin' according to you. And you alone.

The team's success is not bound to a guy who had 6 sacks.

Not bound to your attempted oversimplification in an attempt to support your point either.

 

[jday]

Are you under contract to your employer or can you freely seek out another job?

The latter.

I get what you are saying, but in my opinion, at his age and considering what the Cowboys were able to add to the position during the offseason, he is expendable. Again, I get why he is doing what he is doing, I just don't think he has the leverage to pull it off...but I could be wrong.

Furthermore, I think the Cowboys would be making a mistake to continually fold to non-contents. It's the precedent that I in particular am concerned about.

 

[Stash]

The latter.

I get what you are saying, but in my opinion, at his age and considering what the Cowboys were able to add to the position during the offseason, he is expendable. Again, I get why he is doing what he is doing, I just don't think he has the leverage to pull it off...but I could be wrong.

And don't misunderstand me, I'm not crazy about his tactic either and wish it never happened. But I'm trying to see the position of the player too.

Furthermore, I think the Cowboys would be making a mistake to continually fold to non-contents. It's the precedent that I in particular am concerned about.

I'd be more concerned about that if they were to cut him and let him get his money from and production for somebody else.

The Ratliff and Orton situations bother me a lot more than Scandrick's does.

 

[Doomsday101]

The latter.

I get what you are saying, but in my opinion, at his age and considering what the Cowboys were able to add to the position during the offseason, he is expendable. Again, I get why he is doing what he is doing, I just don't think he has the leverage to pull it off...but I could be wrong.

Furthermore, I think the Cowboys would be making a mistake to continually fold to non-contents. It's the precedent that I in particular am concerned about.

I agree I felt that way on the scandrick situation as well. I hope things are resolved and Mincy gets into training camp, I think he is good solid player whom the Cowboys can depend on to go out and give you some solid play. Not a super star but quality player.

 

[jday]

And don't misunderstand me, I'm not crazy about his tactic either and wish it never happened. But I'm trying to see the position of the player too.



I'd be more concerned about that if they were to cut him and let him get his money from and production for somebody else.

The Ratliff and Orton situations bother me a lot more than Scandrick's does.

I can kinda understand the Cowboys showing Scandrick love and I can also understand why they let Orton and Ratliff walk. For me, Mincey is closer in value to the latter two.

 

[Primetime42]

JAG is always misused. What he is, is a journeyman.

To me, they're pretty much the same. Interchangeable parts.

As if that proves a thing?



Except Mincey. As the numbers clearly show. You know, the ones you continue to try to gloss over.

It's a simplistic stat, one that if I had the time to research each and every snap the two played, I'm sure can be broken down further.

I mean, are you seriously trying to tell me Jeremy Mincey is comparable to a healthy Jason Pierre-Paul? I'd put money on JPP seeing far more double teams and chips last year than Mincey did. FAR more! And that's not even taking into account how certain former Cowboys used to get killed around here for having a high number of pressures without being able to "seal the deal".

As to your second point, being the best of a rag tag group doesn't really speak much. But that's already been said numerous times.

If things go right, barring injury, he'll be the 4th best pass rusher on the team at best by season's end. I'll say it again; his best attributes are as a "leader" type, not what he brings to the field. But to pull this at the last minute isn't very leader-like.

What I like about the situation is that the team will treat it like an opportunity. Next man up. Those young defensive ends want to prove something - well here's their shot to make him expendable. And they don't even have to release him until final cuts.

 

[jday]

I agree I felt that way on the scandrick situation as well. I hope things are resolved and Mincy gets into training camp, I think he is good solid player whom the Cowboys can depend on to go out and give you some solid play. Not a super star but quality player.

For the moment, I hope the Cowboys take advantage of the situation to evaluate all the young players at that position to see what they have. Who knows, maybe one of those young buck will truly make him expendable.

What I would love to see is for that to happen and then the Cowboys go to the Super Bowl while Mincey is still sitting at home on the couch. That would be a story that rivals that of Walley Pipp.

 

[speedkilz88]

To me, they're pretty much the same. Interchangeable parts.


It's a simplistic stat, one that if I had the time to research each and every snap the two played, I'm sure can be broken down further.

I mean, are you seriously trying to tell me Jeremy Mincey is comparable to a healthy Jason Pierre-Paul? I'd put money on JPP seeing far more double teams and chips last year than Mincey did. FAR more! And that's not even taking into account how certain former Cowboys used to get killed around here for having a high number of pressures without being able to "seal the deal".

As to your second point, being the best of a rag tag group doesn't really speak much. But that's already been said numerous times.

If things go right, barring injury, he'll be the 4th best pass rusher on the team at best by season's end. I'll say it again; his best attributes are as a "leader" type, not what he brings to the field. But to pull this at the last minute isn't very leader-like.

What I like about the situation is that the team will treat it like an opportunity. Next man up. Those young defensive ends want to prove something - well here's their shot to make him expendable. And they don't even have to release him until final cuts.

That is why it is so misused. Ignorance is bliss.

 

[Doomsday101]

For the moment, I hope the Cowboys take advantage of the situation to evaluate all the young players at that position to see what they have. Who knows, maybe one of those young buck will truly make him expendable.

What I would love to see is for that to happen and then the Cowboys go to the Super Bowl while Mincey is still sitting at home on the couch. That would be a story that rivals that of Walley Pipp.

I think there will ample snaps thought out camp for these young guys to compete, but it is not just about starting it is about giving quality depth. I fully expect he will not be holding out very long if at all.
I thinik Mincey value is greater than the pay he is getting but again this deal struck last year was agreed on by Mincey and the Cowboys and I expect Mincey to honor the deal. If Cowboys choose to extend the deal a year or add an incentive to the deal that is their choice