Next Time we Discuss Dak's Stats

[Runwildboys]

When evaluating a QB it makes perfect sense to ignore the YAC.

It's the throw that matters. What the receiver does with the ball after the completion is how you evaluate the receiver, not the QB.

Of course good ball placement leads to YAC but that can be evaluated by looking at the throw.

Some of you guys clearly have no objectivity when you consider these stats and are only using them to "prove" the conclusion you've already come to.

On both sides of the argument.

 

[Aviano90]

When evaluating a QB it makes perfect sense to ignore the YAC.

It's the throw that matters. What the receiver does with the ball after the completion is how you evaluate the receiver, not the QB.

Of course good ball placement leads to YAC but that can be evaluated by looking at the throw.

Some of you guys clearly have no objectivity when you consider these stats and are only using them to "prove" the conclusion you've already come to.

On both sides of the argument.

Exactly. Not only that, there is little consistency between the evaluation of different players. YAC is good for one but bad for another in order to prove the predetermined conclusion. Really, there is no consistency...just a bunch of double standards.

 

[G2]

That's not how this works. That's not how any of this works.

Original.

 

[G2]

Exactly. Not only that, there is little consistency between the evaluation of different players. YAC is good for one but bad for another in order to prove the predetermined conclusion. Really, there is no consistency...just a bunch of double standards.

When you have a problem with a designed play extending for a 90 yard TD, then I'd say that particular side is pretty telling. Some fans want Prescott to fail so badly it must hurt.

 

[Philmonroe]

There is nothing average about 17 rushing tds from your qb in less than 3 years. Very few qbs have done that in the history of the league I would guess.

Also, his first 2 3/4 years in the league....I doubt there are more than a couple who have put up better numbers across the board to start their careers. Also, NOT AVERAGE.

So please....what is so average about this qb again?

Dak is avg and if you want to believe he is more than that and use them flawed stats do that. Don't care what you think just as I'm sure you feel the same about me. Dak is avg and if you disagree that's cool too.

 

[Vtwin]

On both sides of the argument.

Very true.

 

[Jarv]

Dak is the Cowboys "guy". Either support or go find another team.

Actually I'm looking for a better QB for my team. Deal with it or leave, your choice.

 

[Kevinicus]

Except when they discuss QB's.

They always mention their record as a starter or their ability to win games.

"They" are stupid. Ignore "they."

 

[OmerV]

As I've previously noted in our 3 game win streak those two passes accounted for almost 20% of Dak's total yardage while accounting for 2% of his pass attempts.

They are outliers and as such are treated as such.

And, again, in doing that, you are treating him differently than every other QB in the NFL who gets credit for yardage after the catch, and falsely treating it as those possessions ended before those passes were thrown, as if even the in air portion of the pass doesn't even count, and as if the 2 passes weren't even enough to get a first down and perpetuate the possession and give Dak additional downs and opportunities to throw. How is it fair to pretend two entire possessions were cut off prior to those passes?

 

[LatinMind]

Dak was not fantastic passing his rookie year. He was the same limited QB he is now. Defenses are now aware he can't really play the position and his warts have shown.

That year was not sustainable just like Robert Griffin III's rookie year wasn't. You can't consistently win in this league in such a limited offense. Defenses figure out what you're doing and force you to do something else. Dak Prescott can't do anything else. He's only capable of playing checkdown game manager hoping his running game and defense can carry him.

Is it him or the system? How does he have better numbers then the top 2 overall picks in his draft over their entire careers? Not just his rookie yr. Its including his past 2 yrs that you claim he is horrible? How can that be? In your post it says limited offense. Shouldnt your post be about the team rather then Dak?

You complain about the coaches and system but its Daks fault

He checks down you have a problem with it

He hands off to Elliot and you complain he doesnt throw.

He throws alot and you complain and that he has a great Rb behind him he should hand off.

Which one is it?

 

[HungryLion]

This actually isn't true. Common logical fallacy.

It is the accumulation of plays that determines a winner. You're just so myopic you focus on the plays at the end of the game and not those throughout.

Sure it is the accumulation of plays. But Some plays are more impactful on the outcome of the game, than others. This is true for many aspects of life. Some actions have greater consequences (good or bad) than others. Every action has consequences. But choosing between eating cereal or pancakes for breakfast probably doesn’t impact my life as much, as an action like cursing my boss out at work.

The rest of my post actually addressed this concept by discussion how each play impacts the rest of the game, from a decision making standpoint and by changing the situation the teams are in.

Which is why you and others wanting to assess Dak’s play after removing his best plays, is idiotic.

 

[cern]

Exactly. Not only that, there is little consistency between the evaluation of different players. YAC is good for one but bad for another in order to prove the predetermined conclusion. Really, there is no consistency...just a bunch of double standards.

it's like special relativity. one problem. two completely different answers. but both answers are correct depending on the observation point of the viewer.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

Sure it is the accumulation of plays. But Some plays are more impactful on the outcome of the game, than others. This is true for many aspects of life. Some actions have greater consequences (good or bad) than others. Every action has consequences. But choosing between eating cereal or pancakes for breakfast probably doesn’t impact my life as much, as an action like cursing my boss out at work.

The rest of my post actually addressed this concept by discussion how each play impacts the rest of the game, from a decision making standpoint and by changing the situation the teams are in.

Which is why you and others wanting to assess Dak’s play after removing his best plays, is idiotic.

For the record...I have NOT...EVER....said we should remove his best plays.

I HAVE said....REPEATEDLY....that those two plays do not cover up an awful outing and they actually highlight how (below) average he has been over this winning streak. Those 2 passes count. They also account for 2% of his pass plays over the winning streak but account for almost 20% of his total yardage.

What part of having 2% of your passes account for 20% of your pass yards over 3 games is bad don't you understand?

 

[Toruk_Makto]

And, again, in doing that, you are treating him differently than every other QB in the NFL who gets credit for yardage after the catch, and falsely treating it as those possessions ended before those passes were thrown, as if even the in air portion of the pass doesn't even count, and as if the 2 passes weren't even enough to get a first down and perpetuate the possession and give Dak additional downs and opportunities to throw. How is it fair to pretend two entire possessions were cut off prior to those passes?

No. I'm not doing that. Like. At all.

People are using his overall stats from the game to prove he played well. He didn't.

 

[darthseinfeld]

Don't understand the timing of this post. Didn't we win last week? I'm not in love with Dak either, but he made some nice throws, didn't turn the ball over, and got the "W". Can't we save the "Crap on Dak" threads for after a loss?

There is always room for criticism. Even at your best you need to be critical and even at your worst you need to postive.

Im not an adherent to the thought that after a win you should focus on the positive and the negative after a loss.

 

[Verdict]

... Remember Mariota and Monday nights game against the Texans.

Mariota went 22-23 with a perfect passer rating. And yet the Titans were not competitive. This tweet does a good job of explaining why his stats did not match the eye test.



This reminds me of Dak against the Commanders. He was awful essentially the entire game. And yet due to two passes his passer rating was stellar. Eye test > Stats in this case.

As a reminder Dak is 23rd in the NFL in QBR. Top 5? Brees, Mahomes, Rivers, Goff and Wilson in that order.

For added Dak context Joe Flacco and Ryan Fitzpatrick have been better. Fitzpatrick has been benched twice and there is talk Joe has been Wally Pipped. Meanwhile we wouldn't trade Dak for 2 first rounders and are backing up the Brinks truck. Future is bright!

Do us a favor and go find another team to support.

 

[Verdict]

There is always room for criticism. Even at your best you need to be critical and even at your worst you need to postive.

Im not an adherent to the thought that after a win you should focus on the positive and the negative after a loss.

You have to be real about wins and losses. But you aren't a coach so it's ok to gloat after a win. Any win.

 

[DandyDon52]

Yeah, like ole Mariota did last night...opps, wait no it was Rodgers the football GOD did it on Sunday...OPPS

yeah dont talk about rodgers, he does no wrong but his team is 4-6-1
I dont care about dak's stats, except 2 , turnovers, and wins and losses.
right now he is doing better than rodgers. and is 27 million a year cheaper !

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

When evaluating a QB it makes perfect sense to ignore the YAC.

It's the throw that matters. What the receiver does with the ball after the completion is how you evaluate the receiver, not the QB.

Of course good ball placement leads to YAC but that can be evaluated by looking at the throw.

Some of you guys clearly have no objectivity when you consider these stats and are only using them to "prove" the conclusion you've already come to.

Precisely.

On the 90 yarder Dak threw a nice ball into tight coverage (dropped it in between three defenders). Credit where credit is due.

However, I'm not going give him credit for what happened after that as Cooper came to nearly a complete stop, shed a tackler and sprinted the rest of the 65-70 yards.

This isn't fantasy football. Nobody is trying to deduct yardage from his passing total but rather look into what went on in the play in context.

 

[HungryLion]

For the record...I have NOT...EVER....said we should remove his best plays.

I HAVE said....REPEATEDLY....that those two plays do not cover up an awful outing and they actually highlight how (below) average he has been over this winning streak. Those 2 passes count. They also account for 2% of his pass plays over the winning streak but account for almost 20% of his total yardage.

What part of having 2% of your passes account for 20% of your pass yards over 3 games is bad don't you understand?

I don’t know. You’ve presented no data on how this compares to other QB’s. All you’ve presented is your “eye test”

They account for 17%. That total goes down to 13% if you remove the air yards of those plays and only count YAC

So if you do the same things for other QB’s what are their numbers?

Without presenting how it compares to others. Your argument means zilch. Other than just being your opinion.