Rashaan Evans VS Leighton Vander Esch

[BourbonBalz]

If I have a dream about the draft that unrealistic, I'm going to be the getting drafted.

A guy can dream.

 

[InDakWeTrust]

A guy can dream.

I'll send you a bottle of your favorite bourbon if that happens..

 

[jday]

If Dallas is really going to cut Dez, then WR becomes a priority hence why they have looked at practically every WR in this draft. I agree we dont have to take one in the 1st either, also St.Brown isn't going in the first round.

Personally, I think the Cowboys are set at WR for the time being. Granted, both Beasley and Dez are getting a bit long in the tooth, so I understand the attention to the position...I'm just not sure that is our biggest needs, based on their current depth chart.

I'm hoping they wait until the second, mostly because if they do take a WR in the first, my best guess is it would be Ridley...and I'm not that big of a fan of Ridley. If they are looking for a Dez replacement, that's either Sutton or SQBrown...and it's possible (if not probable) that one of them will still be available at the top of the second.

With all that being said, if I was running this draft, the only offensive players I'd be looking at would be to shore up that offensive line. Otherwise, my first 4 picks would likely be defense, unless some one I could not pass up dropped...and even then, I'd have to think long and hard about it.

 

[jday]

If it's down to those two. I take LVE. He looks smoother in all of his movements and the numbers don't lie. If he had 75% of those numbers at Alabama or Ohio State he'd be a top 10 pick across the board.
The downside is that both are borderline first rounders because I think this draft only has like 14 first rounders. The meat is 2ND through 4th rounds.

When dealing with a player from that level of competition, it really is difficult to evaluate how they compare to everyone else. The top high school recruits as a general rule stay away from these types of programs because they know the money in the pro's go to the big school kids, regardless of stats. The other issue I have is with his athleticism he should have those stats because he was a man among boys at his school. In the NFL, he'll be playing along side and against similar athletes. He will no longer be able to rely on the fact that he is the fastest/strongest guy on the field. Most guy's making that type of transition struggle initially and I'm not sure the Cowboys can afford for the guy who would likely be slotted at their MLB spot as a starter to struggle early on. Eventually, he may be great, but the Cowboys need a starter at MLB now. I'm not saying Rashaan is a sure-fire first round selection. There is only about 12 to 15 of those every year anyway, and the Cowboys are picking at 19, so I wasn't counting on that to begin with. But for how I think the Cowboys would use him (1st and 2nd down / predominant run stopper / slide of the field on passing downs) he might just be perfect. But how they use him, admittedly, will be key. If they are asking him to come in and be a 3-down player from the beginning, that could also be an issue.

 

[BourbonBalz]

I remember a certain DE/OLB from a "small school" we took with a high pick in the first round. It worked out really well. The NFL Hall of Fame is full of players from smaller schools. I'm not concerned with the level of competition LVE played. It's not like he was playing at the FCS level or below. He would be a good pick. I'd rather have a DT in our spot, but if we're picking a LB, he's the one I'd want that would be available.

 

[jday]

I remember a certain DE/OLB from a "small school" we took with a high pick in the first round. It worked out really well. The NFL Hall of Fame is full of players from smaller schools. I'm not concerned with the level of competition LVE played. It's not like he was playing at the FCS level or below. He would be a good pick. I'd rather have a DT in our spot, but if we're picking a LB, he's the one I'd want that would be available.

For every Demarcus Ware (I assume that was who you are referring to) there are far too many bust. Leighton might be great, but my guess is he's going to take a minute to develop and I don't think the Cowboys have a minute to develop their starting MLB.

I want a DT too...but Dallas has devalued the position, so I'm guessing linebacker is our next best bet. DT, MLB, or S and I'll be happy...so long as it's not some guy I've never heard of...again.

 

[BourbonBalz]

I know we haven't valued the DT position that much in the past, but for some reason I think there's a good chance that changes in this year's draft. I hope I'm right.

 

[jday]

I know we haven't valued the DT position that much in the past, but for some reason I think there's a good chance that changes in this year's draft. I hope I'm right.

I've said it in just about everything I've contributed: Vita Vea is who I really, really want. The last time I wanted a player this bad was Ezekiel Elliott and for largely the same reason just on the other side of the ball. Vita would have Zeke-like impact on that defensive line. But 1. I'm not sure he falls to 19 and 2. if he does, I'm not certain the Cowboys would do it. I hope you are right too, though.

 

[Roland]

I've said it in just about everything I've contributed: Vita Vea is who I really, really want. The last time I wanted a player this bad was Ezekiel Elliott and for largely the same reason just on the other side of the ball. Vita would have Zeke-like impact on that defensive line. But 1. I'm not sure he falls to 19 and 2. if he does, I'm not certain the Cowboys would do it. I hope you are right too, though.

Wouldn't that shock everyone! Jerry jumps up a few spots and snags Vita. Couple that with a lb or two, a safety. Add in the possibility of Gregory...suddenly this Defense looks pretty darn good to me with some good depth as well. That's contender potential right there.

 

[Roland]

Wouldn't that shock everyone! Jerry jumps up a few spots and snags Vita. Couple that with a lb or two, a safety. Add in the possibility of Gregory...suddenly this Defense looks pretty darn good to me with some good depth as well. That's contender potential right there.

But to your original question, if we are picking a lb in the first, I would have to take Evans...stuff the run!

 

[jday]

Wouldn't that shock everyone! Jerry jumps up a few spots and snags Vita. Couple that with a lb or two, a safety. Add in the possibility of Gregory...suddenly this Defense looks pretty darn good to me with some good depth as well. That's contender potential right there.

Overall, I honestly think I'd learn to love the move, but moving up in the first is ridiculously expensive in terms of draft capital. Even moving 3 to 4 spots will cost you a 3rd rounder, so it's hard for me to love that idea going into it knowing the other positions we have needs at, such as MLB and OG. If you tell me we could get Vita Vea in the first, Will Hernandez in the second, and Josey Jewell in the fourth, I'd cosign before you finished asking me if I cosign.

 

[BourbonBalz]

I've said it in just about everything I've contributed: Vita Vea is who I really, really want. The last time I wanted a player this bad was Ezekiel Elliott and for largely the same reason just on the other side of the ball. Vita would have Zeke-like impact on that defensive line. But 1. I'm not sure he falls to 19 and 2. if he does, I'm not certain the Cowboys would do it. I hope you are right too, though.

I actually think we would take him, but I also don't think he makes it to 19. I doubt they'd consider trading up a few spots to get him, but I would.

 

[Montanalo]

All things considered, I would rather select Vea or Payne if either is available at 19. If the choice is strictly between Evans and Leighton Van Esch, I am selecting Evans simply based on the quality of competition Alabama faced during his college career. Despite his obvious athletic talent, I believe will struggle with the pace of the pro game... maybe not?

 

[jday]

All things considered, I would rather select Vea or Payne if either is available at 19. If the choice is strictly between Evans and Leighton Van Esch, I am selecting Evans simply based on the quality of competition Alabama faced during his college career. Despite his obvious athletic talent, I believe will struggle with the pace of the pro game... maybe not?

You and I are playing off the same page of music, sir.

 

[charron]

I'm just curious...are you just simply looking at there physical make-up and deciding who you think would be a better fit in our defensive scheme?

I ask, because in 2015, I suspect the Cowboys did something similar.

With the 27th pick overall, the Dallas Cowboys selected Byron Jones (UConn - FBS).

Six picks later, the Giants landed Landon Collins (Alabama Crimson Tide - SEC).

Byron Jones has worked out so well they are trying him at corner next year.

Landon Collins has been to 2 Pro Bowl's.

Things that make you go "Hmmmm."

This just illustrates Dallas's inability to draft or teach safeties. They just look at the sparq and assume the athletics will = production.

 

[ccb04]

Well, two similarities between Urlacher & Vander Esch would be size/athleticism & the fact that both played at schools in what is now the Mountain West Conference (New Mexico & Boise St).

As far as Boise St. goes...the Cowboys have went to that well defensively on a few occasions with DLaw, Scandrick & Crawford. They haven't drafted a 'bust' from Boise concerning that group...whereas the other guy that some compare Vander Esch to, the infamous Bobby Carpenter, busted out of the Big10/Ohio St.

I'd prefer LVE between the two. Think he has the potential to be a very good 3 down LB who affects coverage in a passing league. With his size/length/athleticism, Vander Esch also has the tools to become consistently bullish vs. the run as well (both in the hole & in pursuit)...and think he could play any of the 3 LB spots.

Vander Esch did it for one season (a primary concern)...whereas Urlacher led the nation in tackles one season & had 440+ in his college career while also being very good in coverage. Both Urlacher and Vander Esch were multi-sport athletes & multi-faceted on the football field in HS.

 

[jday]

Well, two similarities between Urlacher & Vander Esch would be size/athleticism & the fact that both played at schools in what is now the Mountain West Conference (New Mexico & Boise St).

As far as Boise St. goes...the Cowboys have went to that well defensively on a few occasions with DLaw, Scandrick & Crawford. They haven't drafted a 'bust' from Boise concerning that group...whereas the other guy that some compare Vander Esch to, the infamous Bobby Carpenter, busted out of the Big10/Ohio St.

I'd prefer LVE between the two. Think he has the potential to be a very good 3 down LB who affects coverage in a passing league. With his size/length/athleticism, Vander Esch also has the tools to become consistently bullish vs. the run as well (both in the hole & in pursuit)...and think he could play any of the 3 LB spots.

Vander Esch did it for one season (a primary concern)...whereas Urlacher led the nation in tackles one season & had 440+ in his college career while also being very good in coverage. Both Urlacher and Vander Esch were multi-sport athletes & multi-faceted on the football field in HS.

Great response.


But in my opinion it's not about whose the better all-around linebacker. It's about who is better at shedding blocks and getting to the ball carrier. Evans has exhibited this ability whereas LVE reportedly struggles in that area. Long-term, he might be a good addition, but he may struggle initially and the Cowboys are looking for a starter in one of the most important positions in the middle of the defense... whomever they pick they better get it right.

 

[ccb04]

Great response.


But in my opinion it's not about whose the better all-around linebacker. It's about who is better at shedding blocks and getting to the ball carrier. Evans has exhibited this ability whereas LVE reportedly struggles in that area. Long-term, he might be a good addition, but he may struggle initially and the Cowboys are looking for a starter in one of the most important positions in the middle of the defense... whomever they pick they better get it right.

Well said...and I agree. Thing is, even the top guys such as Edmunds, might have initial limitations...but in his case size, athleticism, overall upside, etc. is what intrigues. The consensus top two LB's (Edmunds & Smith), both come with question marks. Much like the secondary last season, if they go younger, they're bound to experience some up's & downs.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

I remember a certain DE/OLB from a "small school" we took with a high pick in the first round. It worked out really well. The NFL Hall of Fame is full of players from smaller schools. I'm not concerned with the level of competition LVE played. It's not like he was playing at the FCS level or below. He would be a good pick. I'd rather have a DT in our spot, but if we're picking a LB, he's the one I'd want that would be available.

Ware is the anomaly. Cowboys have learned the hard way of getting guys from small schools.

 

[jday]

Well said...and I agree. Thing is, even the top guys such as Edmunds, might have initial limitations...but in his case size, athleticism, overall upside, etc. is what intrigues. The consensus top two LB's (Edmunds & Smith), both come with question marks. Much like the secondary last season, if they go younger, they're bound to experience some up's & downs.

I honestly think this would benefit us more at the MLB spot.








I know LVE has similar highlights...but you really have to consider the competition level difference.