RUMOR: Glenn and Jerry reach contract agreement!

[Stash]

When was the last time Owens made it a full 16 games? Not that you are calling him young but if it can be said gor Glenn, why not for Owens?

When was the last time Owens played 1 game?

 

[Doomsday101]

When was the last time Owens made it a full 16 games? Not that you are calling him young but if it can be said gor Glenn, why not for Owens?

The difference is Glenn's pre-condition heading into a season. It is like having a car that you feel is about ready to break down yet you take it on a cross country drive anyways.

 

[odog422]

Pretty clear by now that this RUMOR isn't true yet.

It may still happen, but if it had we'd know.

Was thinking the same thing....

 

[cowboyjoe]

most of the time, jerry jones resigns players by 1 pm to 4 pm, so have to wait rest of day to see if true or not, give alittle time, then see

 

[links18]

Odd that Jerry made all that fuss about "protecting the team" finance wise when it comes to Glenn's knee (after hyping him all offseason as the team's answer to the #2 WR position (remember the "as good as ice cream" comment?). What he really needs to be doing is thinking of a strategy to protect the team on the field, if Glenn can't go or goes down during the year. What is that strategy? Austin, Hurd or Stanback (what if TO goes down also?) Joe Horn? (who wants to put their eggs in that basket?).

 

[Idgit]

You mean Dr. Romo Phd? Who's worked with Terry Glenn exactly when recently?

Again, when and where is he "running well and getting into and out of cuts quickly"? He's sure not doing it with his teammates.

His most recent play showed that. He was a non-factor the last time he played in a meaningful game.

Great. Let's 'baby him' and his precious knee and go through 2007 all over again. Maybe we can get another 4 meaningless plays? No thanks. Either he can go or he can't. No more waiting game.

And that means knowing who you can and cannot count on to contribute. A healthy Terry Glenn would be a plus, if such a thing exists. The team needs to know if they can count on him.

I don't have a problem with Glenn 'taking away snaps'. Either the young guys get it done, or they don't and the team moves on.

This 'one point' is everything. Nobody is looking for a repeat of the futility of 2007 and the waiting game to see if Glenn can play or not.

Find out now - either he can, or he can't.

Personally, I had no problem with what happened with TG last year. It was a calculated gamble, and we lost. It happens.

Here's the article where JJ and Tony (and Ray Sherman) talk about TGs prognosis. Pretty clearly it's still up in the air but they expect him to be ready by training camp. There's zero harm in waiting for that.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d8087495e&template=with-video&confirm=true

I'd be curious to poll the board to see what the majority thinks is more likely: 1. Assuming TG is healthy enough to come out of TC - TG making it through a season without re-injuring his knee or 2. Adam Jones making it through a season without having any further off-the-field incidents. Either event would likely lead to the player being lost for the year. Neither position has experienced depth behind it. Both positions have talented young options, though. Yet nobody seems to mind the prospect of taking the chance on Adam Jones to buy time for our younger players to develop.

On the one hand, we've got a veteran player who's been nothing but good for this franchise. On the other, we've got a reforming thug who's got enormous talent and a lot to prove. Yet we extend one the benefit of the doubt where the other has to prove it now. Honestly, stasherro, and I don't know where you stand on having Pacman aboard, but doesn't that seem a little bit backwards to you?

 

[Stash]

Personally, I had no problem with what happened with TG last year. It was a calculated gamble, and we lost. It happens.

And you're perfectly willing to 'lose' again?

I'm not.

I didn't like 'losing' last year and I want no part of it this year.

Here's the article where JJ and Tony (and Ray Sherman) talk about TGs prognosis. Pretty clearly it's still up in the air but they expect him to be ready by training camp. There's zero harm in waiting for that.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d8087495e&template=with-video&confirm=true

I don't know about 'zero harm' if waiting for Glenn's health means missing out on a viable option. If he's healthy and ready to go, let him show it now.

I'd be curious to poll the board to see what the majority thinks is more likely: 1. Assuming TG is healthy enough to come out of TC - TG making it through a season without re-injuring his knee or 2. Adam Jones making it through a season without having any further off-the-field incidents. Either event would likely lead to the player being lost for the year. Neither position has experienced depth behind it. Both positions have talented young options, though. Yet nobody seems to mind the prospect of taking the chance on Adam Jones to buy time for our younger players to develop.

Sorry, but I think you're waaaaayyy off here. The Cowboys have a 1st round draft pick waiting should Jones screw up and be lost. The Cowboys have 3 question marks should Glenn be lost (or unable to go at all).

On the one hand, we've got a veteran player who's been nothing but good for this franchise. On the other, we've got a reforming thug who's got enormous talent and a lot to prove. Yet we extend one the benefit of the doubt where the other has to prove it now. Honestly, stasherro, and I don't know where you stand on having Pacman aboard, but doesn't that seem a little bit backwards to you?

Not at all. And I don't connect the two in the least. I think the very point you're trying to make is a huge reach bordering on an excuse.

By drafting Jenkins, the Cowboys have insured themselves against a Pacman meltdown. They have thus far failed to do the same regarding Glenn's health issues.

I'm not interested in hearing excuses for Glenn. He's been a fine player for this team but he can either play or he can't.

No 'waiting game', no 'babying' his knee, and no 'resting him' during training camp or practices hoping he can go.

He plays or he doesn't.

If he can't, cut bait and move on.

It's really that simple.

 

[Idgit]

And you're perfectly willing to 'lose' again?

I'm not.

I didn't like 'losing' last year and I want no part of it this year.

I don't know about 'zero harm' if waiting for Glenn's health means missing out on a viable option. If he's healthy and ready to go, let him show it now.

Clearly, it doesn't mean we're missing out on a viable option. It's not like we haven't been looking for alternatives, and it's not like we're not willing to trade for them. It's just that you and the Cowboys have different definitions of what's a viable alternative to Glenn/Hurd/Austin/Stanback.

Sorry, but I think you're waaaaayyy off here. The Cowboys have a 1st round draft pick waiting should Jones screw up and be lost. The Cowboys have 3 question marks should Glenn be lost (or unable to go at all).

And I think you're way off. Sam Hurd is more ready to play in this league than Jenkins is, and by a long shot. Austin's more ready than Scandrick. Stanback is probably in the place the rookie CBs are in terms of development.

Not at all. And I don't connect the two in the least. I think the very point you're trying to make is a huge reach bordering on an excuse.

By drafting Jenkins, the Cowboys have insured themselves against a Pacman meltdown. They have thus far failed to do the same regarding Glenn's health issues.

I'm not interested in hearing excuses for Glenn. He's been a fine player for this team but he can either play or he can't.

No 'waiting game', no 'babying' his knee, and no 'resting him' during training camp or practices hoping he can go.

He plays or he doesn't.

If he can't, cut bait and move on.

It's really that simple.

How is it an excuse? I don't understand where you're coming from at all there.

I'm saying Glenn is a risk. But he's no more of a risk than Pacman, and he's got similar talent at a position of need. There's a risk he won't make it out of TC, and there's a risk Pacman won't be reinstated. There's a risk TG may get re-injured, and there's a risk AJ may feel like singing in the rain some more.

What I don't see is why you're unwilling to wait on Glenn to see if he's healthy enough to make the roster. That just doesn't make any sense to me. What's the opportunity cost for being patient through TC? Almost nothing. Now, when it comes to the active roster, that's a different story, but we're not anywhere near that point yet.

 

[fortdick]

Would I love to have the old Terry Glenn on the field? You bet!

Do I think we will ever see the old Terry Glenn? That is the real question. He is the perfect compliment to TO. After last year, I don;t think we can rely on him. If he thought he wsa back, he would sign the split contract without hesitation, since the salary would be prorated in the event of an injury.

He doesn't believe in his own knee, why should we?

 

[Stash]

Clearly, it doesn't mean we're missing out on a viable option. It's not like we haven't been looking for alternatives, and it's not like we're not willing to trade for them. It's just that you and the Cowboys have different definitions of what's a viable alternative to Glenn/Hurd/Austin/Stanback.

"Clearly"? How so?

And I think you're way off. Sam Hurd is more ready to play in this league than Jenkins is, and by a long shot. Austin's more ready than Scandrick. Stanback is probably in the place the rookie CBs are in terms of development.

Sam Hurd is an undrafted afterthought who may or may not be a decent platoon receiver for the team. To think that his talent is close to Jenkins' is beyond Cowboys' homerism. Experience doesn't equal talent.

How is it an excuse? I don't understand where you're coming from at all there.

When you're somehow trying to pull Adam Jones' situation to Terry Glenn's defense, it sure rings of desparation and excuse-making to me.

I'm saying Glenn is a risk. But he's no more of a risk than Pacman, and he's got similar talent at a position of need. There's a risk he won't make it out of TC, and there's a risk Pacman won't be reinstated. There's a risk TG may get re-injured, and there's a risk AJ may feel like singing in the rain some more.

Again, the Cowboys took steps to insure themselves against Jones missing time. They have not put equivalent insurance in place against Glenn missing time.

What I don't see is why you're unwilling to wait on Glenn to see if he's healthy enough to make the roster. That just doesn't make any sense to me. What's the opportunity cost for being patient through TC? Almost nothing. Now, when it comes to the active roster, that's a different story, but we're not anywhere near that point yet.

When the other side is shouting that he's "healthy", "running great", "making great cuts", and "beating Terrance Newman", it leads people to believe that it's actually true.

I ask:

Where is Glenn running?

Not at Valley Ranch, as he's prohibited from working out.

When is he making these "great cuts" and "beating Newman"?

Not anytime recently.

The fact is that to date he couldn't and cannot pass a team-administered physical.

And if he is healthy and can, let him prove it. Knowledge is power, and the sooner the Cowboys know what they do and do not have going into this season, the better.

I'm not adamantly opposed to waiting until (not 'through')training camp, what I am opposed to is any limited reps, practice or waiting once camp begins. And if the opportunity to obtain a receiver presents itself, the Cowboys shouldn't let Glenn's situation dissuade them from acting on it.

 

[Velvet Jones]

When was the last time Owens played 1 game?

So it is a case of, "This is what you last did for me"? I don't want Glenn if it means for one game. I absolutely want Glenn if it means for all 16. I think the truth is somewhere in between.

 

[Stash]

So it is a case of, "This is what you last did for me"? I don't want Glenn if it means for one game. I absolutely want Glenn if it means for all 16. I think the truth is somewhere in between.

This is a case of going with what you "know" over what you "hope".

Look up the phrase "degenerative knee condition" and look for happy endings or remarkable comebacks. They don't happen.

Seems the best case that people can make is for the unknown.

I had my fill of waiting for the unknown last season.

What I found out was that the guy can't play.

I hope what all the positive quotes say is true. But I want to see it. And soon.

 

[Idgit]

"Clearly"? How so?

Clearly, b/c we've been looking to draft or make a trade and have not. Ergo, the team has not deemed available options viable.

Sam Hurd is an undrafted afterthought who may or may not be a decent platoon receiver for the team. To think that his talent is close to Jenkins' is beyond Cowboys' homerism. Experience doesn't equal talent.

I'm not the only one who disagrees with your assessment of Hurd, and I think you know that. If Romo says he can play in this league, then he can play in this league in my book. We can agree to disagree there.

You're correct that experience does not equal talent. Can we agree that I never said Hurd was more talented than Jenkins? Can I also add that talent does not equal ability? You need more than talent to play well in this league.

When you're somehow trying to pull Adam Jones' situation to Terry Glenn's defense, it sure rings of desparation and excuse-making to me.

Again, the Cowboys took steps to insure themselves against Jones missing time. They have not put equivalent insurance in place against Glenn missing time.

Ah. You're just not taking into account the faith I have in the WR options. I'd also go so far as to say that upgrading our WR situation from last year was not nearly the priority that upgrading the secondary was, so the urgency isn't nearly the same.

In any event, there's no desperation in saying that if TG makes the team, he's more likely to start/complete the season than AJ. It's a perfectly legitimate opinion. Both players are high risks.

When the other side is shouting that he's "healthy", "running great", "making great cuts", and "beating Terrance Newman", it leads people to believe that it's actually true.

I ask:

Where is Glenn running?

Not at Valley Ranch, as he's prohibited from working out.

When is he making these "great cuts" and "beating Newman"?

Not anytime recently.

The fact is that to date he couldn't and cannot pass a team-administered physical.

And if he is healthy and can, let him prove it. Knowledge is power, and the sooner the Cowboys know what they do and do not have going into this season, the better.

I'm not adamantly opposed to waiting until (not 'through')training camp, what I am opposed to is any limited reps, practice or waiting once camp begins. And if the opportunity to obtain a receiver presents itself, the Cowboys shouldn't let Glenn's situation dissuade them from acting on it.

There's no 'other side.' We're all on the same side here. We're just more patient than you are.

I've said in other threads that it's unclear where Tony's been throwing to TG. It seems pretty obvious from context that Romo is referencing real events, though.

Newman's comments again lack context, but they're probably based on historical evidence. They speak to TGs ability, not current state of health. You're not questioning TGs health, so the TNew comments aren't relevant.

I don't know that the facts are that he can't pass a physical. I know he didn't the last time he took it, but I don't know when that was. I had thought it was at the end of last season. His most recent MRI came back clean. And Glenn himself says he's ready to go. Personally, I wouldn't put him on the final roster if he can't pass the team physical, but again, we're a long way from that point.

It's highly unlikely that because of TGs presence we won't add a quality WR should one come available. Sadly, that's not likely to happen this offseason unless we trade for someone.

 

[Idgit]

This is a case of going with what you "know" over what you "hope".

Look up the phrase "degenerative knee condition" and look for happy endings or remarkable comebacks. They don't happen.

Seems the best case that people can make is for the unknown.

I had my fill of waiting for the unknown last season.

What I found out was that the guy can't play.

I hope what all the positive quotes say is true. But I want to see it. And soon.

Velvet, I wouldn't recommend googling 'happy endings' unless you're in a relatively private location.

stash, you, my friend, have what Jerry Jones refers to as a low tolerance for ambiguity. Have a coke and a smile and...just wait for training camp.

 

[khiladi]

I don't know that the facts are that he can't pass a physical. I know he didn't the last time he took it, but I don't know when that was. I had thought it was at the end of last season. His most recent MRI came back clean. And Glenn himself says he's ready to go. Personally, I wouldn't put him on the final roster if he can't pass the team physical, but again, we're a long way from that point.

What does it mean that an MRI came back clean for the type of condition Terry Glenn has? Did his cartilage suddenly re-appear? Does it mean that Terry Glenn's ability to not get sore decreased because his MRI came back clean? Does it mean that Terry Glenn's ability to cut isn't hampered by his degenerative knee condition? Does it mean that Terry Glenn's ability to get injured has been drastically reduced because it came back clean?

An MRI coming back clean in the case of Terry Glenn is pretty vague, because nobody can tell us what they were looking for.

BTW, as far as my knowledge goes, the doctor who gave the "go" for Terry Glenn was a private doctor. Terry Glenn wouldn't pass a physical from any team outside the Cowboys.

 

[Fletch]

I think that Glenn AT THIS MOMENT is capable of being a real threat. BUT he is just one medium hit away from career over or at the very least season over. And therein lies the rub: can anyone seriously believe that he can start all 16 games and the playoffs and last? NO.

I think last season's last game vs. the Commanders at a rainy Fed Ex Field, LaRon Landry helped answer that question when he went low and slid hard into Glenn's knees. Glenn ended up on his backside and still got up just fine.

That was a freakish hit that had Cowboy fans pissed off and worried at the same time. Glenn was fine.

Let's play football!

 

[Idgit]

What does it mean that an MRI came back clean for the type of condition Terry Glenn has? Did his cartilage suddenly re-appear? Does it mean that Terry Glenn's ability to not get sore decreased because his MRI came back clean? Does it mean that Terry Glenn's ability to cut isn't hampered by his degenerative knee condition? Does it mean that Terry Glenn's ability to get injured has been drastically reduced because it came back clean?

Yes. Probably. Maybe. I think you're probably onto something when you say it means his cartilage reappeared.

I have no more idea than you do what his MRI represents. My own MRIs were able to identify cartilage damage and the state of my torn ACL, so I imagine he's clear on those counts. He's still got the bone:bone condition in his knee, but that's a pain tolerance issue primarily.

An MRI coming back clean in the case of Terry Glenn is pretty vague, because nobody can tell us what they were looking for.

BTW, as far as my knowledge goes, the doctor who gave the "go" for Terry Glenn was a private doctor. Terry Glenn wouldn't pass a physical from any team outside the Cowboys.

I'm sure it was a private doctor who told TG he was good to go. FWIW, I'd give that more credence than the team doctor's evaluation in terms of judging the actual state of the knee. Private doctors are subject to malpractice claims, for one. I've yet to meet a doctor who would risk his board certification by exaggerating the health of a high profile patient because they asked nicely.

Team doctors, on the other hand, don't get burned by not clearing a player who's otherwise able to go. And there are numerous reports of teams sandbagging trades and the like because the team doctors say the player in question can't pass a physical. In this case, though, ultimately, I think both personal physician and team doctors should agree the player is ok before he's put on the field, but, again, there's time before we get to that point.

You can't possibly know whether or not TG would pass any other team's physical, so what's the point of claiming that he couldn't? What am I a dog that I can be fooled by the old ball-fake trick? I'm too sharp for that. Usually.

 

[Stash]

Clearly, b/c we've been looking to draft or make a trade and have not. Ergo, the team has not deemed available options viable.

Or what they have has not been available.

I'm not the only one who disagrees with your assessment of Hurd, and I think you know that. If Romo says he can play in this league, then he can play in this league in my book. We can agree to disagree there.

So Hurd is suddenly on the same level of a guy considered by some to be the best cornerback prospect in the draft? Hurd is a nice player but come on. I never said he couldn't play in this league.

You're correct that experience does not equal talent. Can we agree that I never said Hurd was more talented than Jenkins? Can I also add that talent does not equal ability? You need more than talent to play well in this league.

Sure, you didn't say that. But you tried to say that because Hurd has played at the pro level, that the Cowboys were in better shape than with Jenkins, based solely on the fact that Jenkins has yet to suit up at the pro level.

Ah. You're just not taking into account the faith I have in the WR options. I'd also go so far as to say that upgrading our WR situation from last year was not nearly the priority that upgrading the secondary was, so the urgency isn't nearly the same.

Oh, I completely agree. Secondary was a much bigger need. But drafting two cornerbacks and trading for Pacman more than filled that need. And receiver? Nothing.

In any event, there's no desperation in saying that if TG makes the team, he's more likely to start/complete the season than AJ. It's a perfectly legitimate opinion. Both players are high risks.

And the team has insurance behind one, and not the other.

There's no 'other side.' We're all on the same side here. We're just more patient than you are.

Imobviously meant regarding this topic. Plenty of people want to tell me that Glenn is 'ready to go' which is bunk. You seem perfectly content with the results from waiting for Glenn last year - I'm not. My 'patience' was used up then.

I've said in other threads that it's unclear where Tony's been throwing to TG. It seems pretty obvious from context that Romo is referencing real events, though.

Yeah, maybe they're 'sneaking in' workouts behind the team's back, huh? If someone can show me where and when these supposed workouts took place, I'll give them relevance and credibility. Until then it's all wishful thinking.

Newman's comments again lack context, but they're probably based on historical evidence. They speak to TGs ability, not current state of health. You're not questioning TGs health, so the TNew comments aren't relevant.

And yet people try to use them to backup their position on him now.

I don't know that the facts are that he can't pass a physical. I know he didn't the last time he took it, but I don't know when that was. I had thought it was at the end of last season. His most recent MRI came back clean. And Glenn himself says he's ready to go. Personally, I wouldn't put him on the final roster if he can't pass the team physical, but again, we're a long way from that point.

What would you expect Glenn to say? The only thing I do know is that he couldn't pass the end of season physical and refused to take the most recent one.

It's highly unlikely that because of TGs presence we won't add a quality WR should one come available. Sadly, that's not likely to happen this offseason unless we trade for someone.

The team was fully capable of making the mistake of waiting for Glenn last season. I'm not convinced that they wouldn't make the same one.

And I wholeheartedly hope that the team does trade for one. This is a Super Bowl or bust season and the team should do everything they can to make that happen.

 

[Stash]

stash, you, my friend, have what Jerry Jones refers to as a low tolerance for ambiguity. Have a coke and a smile and...just wait for training camp.

Check that - no tolerance.

 

[Stash]

Yes. Probably. Maybe. I think you're probably onto something when you say it means his cartilage reappeared.

And I think you're 'on something' if you think it magically did. If it came back 'clear' it means that there were no loose bodies floating around, not than any cartilage magically reappeared. Nothing short of microfracture surgery would do that and even that is no guaranteee.

I have no more idea than you do what his MRI represents. My own MRIs were able to identify cartilage damage and the state of my torn ACL, so I imagine he's clear on those counts. He's still got the bone:bone condition in his knee, but that's a pain tolerance issue primarily.

"Pain" which kept him out of 15 of 16 games last season.

I'm sure it was a private doctor who told TG he was good to go. FWIW, I'd give that more credence than the team doctor's evaluation in terms of judging the actual state of the knee. Private doctors are subject to malpractice claims, for one. I've yet to meet a doctor who would risk his board certification by exaggerating the health of a high profile patient because they asked nicely.

Yeah, it was the same doctor who performed the original surgery. I wouldn't expect him to say that he screwed it up, would you? The team made the reccommendation that microfracture was needed. Glenn and his doctor felt differently and did what they wanted.

Team doctors, on the other hand, don't get burned by not clearing a player who's otherwise able to go. And there are numerous reports of teams sandbagging trades and the like because the team doctors say the player in question can't pass a physical. In this case, though, ultimately, I think both personal physician and team doctors should agree the player is ok before he's put on the field, but, again, there's time before we get to that point.

Yeah, until the start of training camp.

You can't possibly know whether or not TG would pass any other team's physical, so what's the point of claiming that he couldn't? What am I a dog that I can be fooled by the old ball-fake trick? I'm too sharp for that. Usually.

If his knee can't pass the Cowboys' physical, some other team isn't going to miss it. His degenerative knee condition is a matter of public knowledge.