Star-Telegram - Surprise!! Barber gets the lower 1st rd tender

[iceberg]

It won't be atlanta......Try a team drafting late in the 1st.

I don't like the move, I think its stupid. Im glad dallas can match but I think Jerry is praying for a taker.

maybe he is. or maybe he's just being patient and not a fanbased chicken little who things a few JJT articles and some newsgroup postings gives them the same level of background info as jones has to make his decisions.

so he offers $2.6mil - is the world happy?

1. he still can't stop the poison pill
2. he still can't stop barber from signing elsewhere if he wants to
3. we only "lose" a 3rd round pick at most on this. that's it. we don't lose barber cause if we got the 3rd rounder people clamor over now we lost barber anyway.
4. jones will let the market say how much barber is worth
5. jones then can match that or let him go and take the pick and run.
6. if a poison pill is put in there and barber signs it, then why would not that scream he wanted to be elsewhere?

i don't see the need for the clamor going on now for this. nothing has really changed since yesterday except for the potential loss of a 3rd rounder.

in the end that's the only change.

yet look at the panic.

 

[Big Dakota]

It's not illegal. The league may frown upon it, but there hasn't been any reported rule change.

Florio on PFT seems to think that because of the backlash due to the Seattle/Minny deals, that teams have a silent agreement not to use them.

That's my take, but for a player like MBIII, one might risk the hard feelings. It just seems like Jerry is dangling the kid, considering the differense between the 1st round tneder and the 1st and 3rd tender. Considering, if they signed him to a big deal they'd end up paying him that or more year one with the SB and salary.

 

[masomenos]

6. if a poison pill is put in there and barber signs it, then why would not that scream he wanted to be elsewhere?

It could just mean that Barber was doing what was best for himself economically, not necessarily "scream" that he wanted to be elsewhere.

 

[JohnnyHopkins]

Pure speculation, but perhaps both Camps are far enough apart in negotiations that it is certain MBIII will play out the one year deal. If so, why risk letting him walk the following season for nothing?

Only placing a first round tender leaves some wiggle room for teams to take a look, but at the same time allows for good compensation to draft a replacement if Barber's Market Value is too high. If there are no takers, then Jones has better leverage to sign Barber for a more agreeable long term deal.

 

[superpunk]

I recall the Pats using a poison pill in Wes Walker's contract offer, (something about playing only so many games in Florida), and the Fins were so upset about it that Kraft and Huizenga struck a deal between themselves personally to avoid any hard feelings and that's how the Fins got a 2nd round pick out of the deal.

So poison pills may be frowned upon now and teams may be reluctant to use them, but I don't know that they are illegal.

The poison pill nonsense has not been done away with, but it was not put in Welker's contract. Seattle did something like that with Nate Burleson, saying that if he played a certain number of games in Minnesota...but New England didn't. Miami received a second because that was the tender they gave Welker.

 

[Angus]

The lower tender information may be merely a trial balloon to see what kind of reaction other teams might have? If it appears other teams are willing to pay the high amounts Barber and his agent want and Jones would have to pay that anyway to match, he may decide to change the tender to the higher one and get an extra third in the mix when deciding whether to match?

 

[iceberg]

It would just mean that Barber was doing what was best for himself economically, not necessarily "scream" that he wanted to be elsewhere.

maybe. possible. but then again, it prevents the cowboys from offering the "same" money. it gives a huge advantage to the team to sign the FA vs. the team to keep him.

if barber merely wants say $3mil a year and jones w//his tender is only ponying up $2mil - then TEAM X offers barber $2.5mil a year and a bonus of $250k for every game he plays in texas stadium.

suddenly if an NFCE team, barber makes $3mil, + maybe $250k more should we host a playoff game.

but if we match the deal (and we can't change it only match) then we pay barber $2.5mil salary then $2mil more just to play in texas stadium for 8 games during the year. our cost on barber is $4.5mil and the giants, for example, would be $3mil.

w/o the pill we can match the $2.5m and barber can stay here. so i don't see how it's *just* about money in as much as the ability to play elsewhere.

i don't blame barber or any player at all for making a living. but people sure do blame jones for making business decsions here, don't they?

 

[superpunk]

We can always match the offer. I don't think we'd see a situation where we couldn't.

But if someone offers that, and we can't, suddenly we're armed with three first round picks. Suddenly it becomes very feasible for us to acquire McFadden or Mendelhall, and still be able to retain another first rounder and maybe trade back picking a corner, WR, and setting ourselves up pretty well.

 

[theebs]

Hopefully, they have a long term deal in place. I dont think with the available free agents who are unrestricted and the quality in the draft that anyone would do that this year.

I am crossing my fingers that he has a long term deal worked out and the holdup has something to do with Flozell adams negotiations and what he might cost.

It would be a devastating blow to the chemistry of this team if he were to leave right now.

 

[Goldenrichards83]

How much money do you think Turner will want?

4-5 yrs 20-22 million

 

[speedkilz88]

For all we know the scouts may think Ray Rice is the next Emmitt. I do think if Barber does get only the first round tender that its possible he leaves. Most teams wouldn't give up a first for a rb, but it only takes one team to fall in love with a player.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

The poison pill nonsense has not been done away with, but it was not put in Welker's contract. Seattle did something like that with Nate Burleson, saying that if he played a certain number of games in Minnesota...but New England didn't. Miami received a second because that was the tender they gave Welker.

The poison pill was an issue with Welker. Here's an exerpt from an old article from NFL Network from last off-season that explains what happened...
**********************************************************
Patriots could suddenly be rich in receivers

(March 5, 2007) -- To the relief of quarterback Tom Brady and the rest of Patriot Nation, New England signed one wide receiver and could soon add another.

After trading 2007 second- and seventh-round draft choices to Miami for wide receiver Wes Welker and signing him to a five-year, $18.1 million contract that included $9 million in guaranteed money, the Patriots were scheduled to host a visit with Philadelphia free-agent wide receiver Donte' Stallworth.

As for Welker, the key to completing a trade between the Patriots and Dolphins was the work of their owners, New England's Robert Kraft and Miami's Wayne Huizenga.

Kraft stepped in, not wanting his organization to engage in any type of public battle for Welker's services. The Patriots were poised to sign Welker to a seven-year, $38.5 million contract that contained a "poison pill" that said if the wide receiver played four games in Florida, his contract would become fully guaranteed.

Knowing the feud that developed last year between Minnesota and Seattle over free-agent guard Steve Hutchinson, Kraft helped engineer the trade with Huizenga. The Patriots would have had to give up the second-round pick to sign Welker anyway; the seventh-round pick was added partly as a goodwill gesture, and mostly to avoid any protracted hearing between the two sides.

 

[masomenos]

i don't blame barber or any player at all for making a living. but people sure do blame jones for making business decsions here, don't they?

Well I think that it would be easy for one team to value Barber more than we do and they could end up overpaying for him. So if the money was substantially more than what we were offering then of course Barber would leave. I'm sure Jerry and Barber's agent have talked basic #s on a deal so when the first offer sheet comes through everyone will have an idea with where things stand. However, if the deal was something like what you outlined then yeah it would basically be up to Barber's choice of team.

It's easier to forgive a player for going after money because their time in the league is up in the air, they really have to make sure they get a good contract as soon as possible in order to cover any possible injuries. With owners though, they decide how long they'll be in the league and obviously already have gobs of cash. So for the people who think Jerry's pinching pennies and risking a very valuable part of the team then I think it can definitely come across as a gamble. Personally I see the logic behind giving Barber a 1st round tender, it's just as a fan I hate it lol.

 

[superpunk]

The poison pill was an issue with Welker. Here's an exerpt from an old article from NFL Network from last off-season that explains what happened...
**********************************************************
Patriots could suddenly be rich in receivers

(March 5, 2007) -- To the relief of quarterback Tom Brady and the rest of Patriot Nation, New England signed one wide receiver and could soon add another.

After trading 2007 second- and seventh-round draft choices to Miami for wide receiver Wes Welker and signing him to a five-year, $18.1 million contract that included $9 million in guaranteed money, the Patriots were scheduled to host a visit with Philadelphia free-agent wide receiver Donte' Stallworth.

As for Welker, the key to completing a trade between the Patriots and Dolphins was the work of their owners, New England's Robert Kraft and Miami's Wayne Huizenga.

Kraft stepped in, not wanting his organization to engage in any type of public battle for Welker's services. The Patriots were poised to sign Welker to a seven-year, $38.5 million contract that contained a "poison pill" that said if the wide receiver played four games in Florida, his contract would become fully guaranteed.

Knowing the feud that developed last year between Minnesota and Seattle over free-agent guard Steve Hutchinson, Kraft helped engineer the trade with Huizenga. The Patriots would have had to give up the second-round pick to sign Welker anyway; the seventh-round pick was added partly as a goodwill gesture, and mostly to avoid any protracted hearing between the two sides.

So that's why they got the 7th, in addition, not the second.

 

[iceberg]

Well I think that it would be easy for one team to value Barber more than we do and they could end up overpaying for him. So if the money was substantially more than what we were offering then of course Barber would leave. I'm sure Jerry and Barber's agent have talked basic #s on a deal so when the first offer sheet comes through everyone will have an idea with where things stand. However, if the deal was something like what you outlined then yeah it would basically be up to Barber's choice of team.

It's easier to forgive a player for going after money because their time in the league is up in the air, they really have to make sure they get a good contract as soon as possible in order to cover any possible injuries. With owners though, they decide how long they'll be in the league and obviously already have gobs of cash. So for the people who think Jerry's pinching pennies and risking a very valuable part of the team then I think it can definitely come across as a gamble. Personally I see the logic behind giving Barber a 1st round tender, it's just as a fan I hate it lol.

don't get me wrong - i want to keep barber also. but like you say, if another team falls in love and wants him more than we either do or put value on him - who's going to *really* know him better?

poison pill aside, if another teams ponies up more than we feel he's worth, we still have the option to sign or match.

we've really lost nothing in this move except the potential of a 3rd rounder to go with the 1st.

if i'm missing what else we've lost, i'd love to hear it.

 

[Bach]

well i see the idiots convention is on break right now .

I hear they are holding it at "the colony"

 

[Fatty_VM]

We have less than 10 mil left in our cap. That's not counting any other tags or signings we need (but it IS counting the rookies).

We can EASILY be out priced by an offer from those teams with 20+ mil free. There are 8 or so right now who have the chance.

 

[theebs]

there is a guy named Bob Glauber on espn right now, he is a writer for newsday.

he maybe the dumbest nfl guy I have ever heard.

He just said we are linked to moss and that you could look for Miami to sign barber. Right. They will give up the 1st pick in the draft. Right.

Then he just said we are also interested in Alan Faneca.

Where do they find these people. 90% of this board has more Football IQ than the people on espn.

I cant believe how bad that guy just was.

also, why is no one talking about new orleans. they have one of the best offenses in the league and 30 million dollars in cap space. Shouldnt they be the team linked to all the defensive free agents.

 

[Stash]

I wonder if this has anything to do with Barber and Rosenhaus' asking price?

 

[Fatty_VM]

And personally it's fine if we lose barber, but I will be alot more angry in losing Canty.