The next guy who blames T.O

[RainMan]

Gun, while you make good points, what about the way Aikman yelled at his teammates, Irvin screamed, ranted and raved?

The obvious problem is we never know what's truly being said on the sidelines. We can assume based off lip reading, facial expressions and body language, but we never know.

Troy could have easily been telling his teammates, "You're making me look bad. Do your damn job." But nothing in his history suggested that to be the case.

There are plenty of times where Owens looks like he's trying to be a legitimate leader. Plenty! He's seen motivating the linemen, giving players pep talks, getting in guys faces at times where he's clearly not yelling some self-serving message of "Get me the ball!"

The problem with Owens is that, just as Jerry undermines Wade, he constantly undermines any leadership abilities he shows with his me-first nature. Even when he's trying to be a nice guy in a post-game press conference, he typically drops lines like "We've just got to perform better. But it's frustrating because I was open. Look at the film."

I defend T.O. sometimes, but that's a comment that makes you squirm as you hear it. It's something he can say behind closed doors but just throws people under the bus when uttered publicly. And he constantly chips away at the credibility he builds up with those sorts of comments.

 

[Boysboy]

The obvious problem is we never know what's truly being said on the sidelines. We can assume based off lip reading, facial expressions and body language, but we never know.

Troy could have easily been telling his teammates, "You're making me look bad. Do your damn job." But nothing in his history suggested that to be the case.

There are plenty of times where Owens looks like he's trying to be a legitimate leader. Plenty! He's seen motivating the linemen, giving players pep talks, getting in guys faces at times where he's clearly not yelling some self-serving message of "Get me the ball!"

The problem with Owens is that, just as Jerry undermines Wade, he constantly undermines any leadership abilities he shows with his me-first nature. Even when he's trying to be a nice guy in a post-game press conference, he typically drops lines like "We've just got to perform better. But it's frustrating because I was open. Look at the film."

I defend T.O. sometimes, but that's a comment that makes you squirm as you hear it. It's something he can say behind closed doors but just throws people under the bus when uttered publicly. And he constantly chips away at the credibility he builds up with those sorts of comments.

I think he tries too hard.

 

[Nav22]

It was the first Skins game. Whoop dee doo.

We lost the first 'Skins game. It always cracks me up when someone so arrogantly condescending doesn't know what in Sam Hill he's talking about.

Bill Cowher, the guy many here are pining for, said yesterday that the first thing a new coach should do is cut TO. Care to compare your credentials to his?

Oooh, so we should cut T.O. because BILL COWHER (a media member) says so?

What about what OUR coaches and players think? You know, the ones who actually spend all season with T.O.?

Nah, I guess Bill Cowher, from his cushy studio, knows the inner workings of T.O. and his affect on the Cowboys... more than the Cowboys do.

The "problem" was Tony's lack of discretion.

For whatever reason, it became a major story before the playoff game. No matter how you spin it.

If T.O.'s antics are a "problem", then the Cabo trip was a disaster.

And to say there's a huge gulf between a mini-vacation and selfishly-inspired locker room turmoil is to beg the obvious.

The locker-room turmoil that Ed Werder reported? The one that preceded a win and a buddy-buddy-buddy postgame interview on NBC?

You mean like all those other teams that are better than us sans Owens. Yeah, I think we could have pulled that off.

You suggested in your last post that you agree that Owens is one of our best players. Still no support from you to suggest we'd have been a better team without him.

Sure he did. Get a clue. I said he was a rat, not stupid.

Provide some substance. How has he stabbed Tony in the back? If pining for the ball is stabbing your QB in the back, Michael Irvin was Norman Bates (insert Everett McIver joke here).

You seem to think that "wanting to win" and "acting like a professional" are incompatible.

No. But when Irvin or Rice would scream on the sidelines, they were "being fiery, emotional leaders" according to the media. When T.O. does it, he's being a "cancer".

The actions are the same. It's just the perception that's different.

Real vs. perceived...

Show me where Witten, Romo, Staubach, or Dorsett screamed at teammates or coaches when things weren't going their way.

Staubach and Dorsett were before my time.

Romo was screaming at the OL last year in the 4th quarter of the Giants game. Many claimed he was "losing his composure". Aikman screamed at teammates all the time. Ditto Michael Irvin and Emmitt Smith. Witten screamed at Drew Bledsoe at the end of our loss @ Oakland in 2005.

But I suppose it's only a problem when Terrell Owens does it, huh?

 

[Idgit]

I wonder what would happen to fan perception if the team requested (and TO complied) that he just not talk to the media at all next year? Statements issued through the PR department, and informal settings like Inside the Huddle only, but nothing before or after games or for coverage by ESPN or NFLN.

 

[JordanTaber]

#1 he talks too much whether it's negative or positive

Huh? Talks too much where? You have no idea how much he talks compared to anyone else behind closed doors.

If you mean the media, aside from one or two pointless interviews he gives per year with someone like Deion Sanders or Stephen A. Smith, he doesn't do anything that all the other star players don't do.

#2 he threw his qbs under the bus with his "i can't throw it and catch it myself" comment publicly

Are you serious?

This is the perfect example of how every comment with Owens is analyzed for any possible "under the busdom." Under the bus this, under the bus that, under the bus. Owens said the team committed too many penalties, but I noticed he didn't commit any. He just threw da penalty causers under the bus.

Owens said they had too many turnovers. Uh oh, Romo had 5 of da 6. Romo under da bus.

Owens said that he likes the color red. Uh oh, orange, yellow, green, blue, indigo, and violet under da bus!


Owens was simply saying that he isn't the only one in control over his statistics, so using those to try to prove that he was "old" and "has lost a step" is a short-sighted statement. That's what that entire interview was about: Deion asking Owens how his numbers have declined.

Owens's statement was a statement of fact: He CAN'T throw it and catch it.

So what's the problem?

A little context here is all I'm asking. The only way it would be a shot at Romo (or Brad Johnson) is if one or both of them came up in the context of that conversation. Neither did.

OR, if he had offered it up himself in a different context.

#3 he threw his coaches(oc) under the bus publicly

Yet again. Saying the system that he's in is responsible for him not having numbers as big as he had in the past isn't the same as "throwing Jason Garrett under the bus"...especially considering Garrett was the OC LAST SEASON.

If Hines Ward is asked the same thing and talks about his system (a run first offense) being responsible for his numbers decline, does he get under-the-busdom criticism?

#4 he drops too many passes for a "#1 wr"

So then Jerry Rice also dropped too many passes to be a #1 receiver, because as a 49ers fan, I can assure you, Rice dropped many more balls per year than Owens ever has.

#5 he has stunted Romo's growth as a qb and our team with us trying to force the ball to him due to reason #6

OK, now this is just asinine. Seriously. I think we've had this conversation before. Anyone who writes something like this simply isn't all there.

#6 he complains about getting passes too much including after getting 18 passes thrown to him in the 1st skins game(that we lost)

Never complained about it. He was asked if he was satisfied with the number of passes thrown his way. He responded with, "I'm a competitor, so I'm going to have to say no." That's the right way to answer it. Saying "yes" when the team lost the game and you caught 7 balls for 71 yards and a TD is the wrong way to answer it.

Owens was thrown to more times in that game than he ever has been in one game in his entire Cowboys career. Think for a minute; do you think if Owens was going to actually complain about the number of balls thrown his way, it would've been THEN?

#7 guy is a 220 pound muscle freak but has major trouble getting off of jams by 185 pound cornerbacks

Oh please. This is completely false.

#8 even if it was made up drama(the him/romo/witten thing) it was in the media because of him. they don't do that with any other wr.

more to come if you would like.

So he just has to pay and pay and pay and pay and pay for (vastly overblown) things he did YEARS ago?

Because, after all, the CRIMES he committed are just so unforgiveable. Oooooh, he ran to the star twice after scoring touchdowns and looked up through the roof. Oooooh, he autographed a football with a sharpie. Ooooooh, he implied his former quarterback was, in fact, gay, as the interviewer opined.

Lock him in jail and throw away the key.

 

[Rampage]

Huh? Talks too much where? You have no idea how much he talks compared to anyone else behind closed doors.

If you mean the media, aside from one or two pointless interviews he gives per year with someone like Deion Sanders or Stephen A. Smith, he doesn't do anything that all the other star players don't do.



Are you serious?

This is the perfect example of how every comment with Owens is analyzed for any possible "under the busdom." Under the bus this, under the bus that, under the bus. Owens said the team committed too many penalties, but I noticed he didn't commit any. He just threw da penalty causers under the bus.

Owens said they had too many turnovers. Uh oh, Romo had 5 of da 6. Romo under da bus.

Owens said that he likes the color red. Uh oh, orange, yellow, green, blue, indigo, and violet under da bus!


Owens was simply saying that he isn't the only one in control over his statistics, so using those to try to prove that he was "old" and "has lost a step" is a short-sighted statement. That's what that entire interview was about: Deion asking Owens how his numbers have declined.

Owens's statement was a statement of fact: He CAN'T throw it and catch it.

So what's the problem?

A little context here is all I'm asking. The only way it would be a shot at Romo (or Brad Johnson) is if one or both of them came up in the context of that conversation. Neither did.

OR, if he had offered it up himself in a different context.




Yet again. Saying the system that he's in is responsible for him not having numbers as big as he had in the past isn't the same as "throwing Jason Garrett under the bus"...especially considering Garrett was the OC LAST SEASON.

If Hines Ward is asked the same thing and talks about his system (a run first offense) being responsible for his numbers decline, does he get under-the-busdom criticism?



So then Jerry Rice also dropped too many passes to be a #1 receiver, because as a 49ers fan, I can assure you, Rice dropped many more balls per year than Owens ever has.




OK, now this is just asinine. Seriously. I think we've had this conversation before. Anyone who writes something like this simply isn't all there.



Never complained about it. He was asked if he was satisfied with the number of passes thrown his way. He responded with, "I'm a competitor, so I'm going to have to say no." That's the right way to answer it. Saying "yes" when the team lost the game and you caught 7 balls for 71 yards and a TD is the wrong way to answer it.

Owens was thrown to more times in that game than he ever has been in one game in his entire Cowboys career. Think for a minute; do you think if Owens was going to actually complain about the number of balls thrown his way, it would've been THEN?




Oh please. This is completely false.





So he just has to pay and pay and pay and pay and pay for (vastly overblown) things he did YEARS ago?

Because, after all, the CRIMES he committed are just so unforgiveable. Oooooh, he ran to the star twice after scoring touchdowns and looked up through the roof. Oooooh, he autographed a football with a sharpie. Ooooooh, he implied his former quarterback was, in fact, gay, as the interviewer opined.

Lock him in jail and throw away the key.

you're pathetic. i gotta go to work in 3 hours so maybe i'll respond to you but i doubt it. you only see things one way. enjoy terrellzone... i mean COWBOYSzone.com

 

[Tusan_Homichi]

If we sent him packing and became a run oriented team with Austin as the #2 guy and Martellus Bennett getting more action in 2 TE sets with Witten I wouldn't hate it at all. Save the cap money.

If we keep him, I won't hate it either. I'm not the guy's biggest fan, but he wants to win and he's talented.

I actually really like this plan. I think that would be an improvement.

 

[Nav22]

Since when can our OL open holes in the run game for 4 quarters?

 

[Tusan_Homichi]

Since when can our OL open holes in the run game for 4 quarters?

We'd definitely need to look at the o-line. I'm just not real sure where the weak link is. You might say depth at guard after this disaster of a year, but how often do you lose your starting guard and his backup? Flozell looks old, but he just signed a new contract. Gurode seems to not be the smartest player, but he's definitely not bad.

The issue is that we just don't do anything consistently well. Is that a talent thing? A coaching thing? Both?

 

[texmex]

The fundamental problem is nobody in the organziation is capable of accepting reality when it comes to TO - he's an aging NFL WR who has difficulty getting off the LOS, beating double coverage, and will drop the ball every now and then. The key dynamic to creating a cohesive football team is everybody knowing their role. TO's overall ability at this stage of his career doesn't justify him receiving #1 WR treatment from his quarterback or offensive coordinator. But a belief still remains on the team that we must "get TO the ball". And until that mindset changes, the Cowboys offense will struggle to find an identity. If TO had an epiphany and realized he's closer to a #2 receiver than he is a #1 receiver, then I could see hope as the offense could be designed appropriately. But that's not going to happen as neither TO nor Jerry can come to grips with that realization.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

Real trouble, which is why he's on his third team and #4 is just over the horizon. Bill Cowher, the guy many here are pining for, said yesterday that the first thing a new coach should do is cut TO. Care to compare your credentials to his?

Cowher is just talking out of his ***. No coach in their right mind would cut TO as soon as they where hired.

 

[THUMPER]

I'm really going to go OFF and let him have it.
Laced throughout this forum, you can't escape it.
It's the easy target, chicken-crap, no courage, no thinking, scapegoat thing to say.
"Oh, Dallas didn't live up to expectations? Get rid of T.O."
"Oh, the slightest thing wrong? Get rid of T.O."
"Traffic light out in Fort Worth? Get rid of T.O."
"Hurricane passes through Texas? Get rid of T.O."

It's what all the idiot pundits and T.V. talking heads resort to anytime there's a hangnail or nose bleed in Dallas. "Get rid of T.O." The same yappers who so many of you despise for their anti-Dallas sentiments. It takes NO courage to "blame T.O.", because it's safe and you know that nobody will challenge you. It's like telling jokes about white, Christian males, because you know that no one will challenge you on it because it's the "in vogue" and acceptable thing to do.

The only sin T.O. has committed in Dallas is maybe, only because he wants to win so much, that he airs out his thinking in public. But even THAT has been minimal. His reputation precedes him, so he's got to bear the brunt of that. Even though he was right about everything he said in Philly, his way of going about it ruffled alot of feathers.
He's never committed a crime. Never been suspended (by the league) for anything. Stays in maximum shape year round. And wants to win so badly that maybe his mouth runs before his brain realizes it's moving.
If this team had another 40 T.O.'s on it, we wouldn't be in this position.
This team has three major problems, and T.O. isn't one of them.
Jerry Jones meddling and domineering.
Bad and uninspired coaching (see "Jerry's meddling above) resulting in undisciplined and stupid play.
And finally, Romo needs to be "Holmgrenized".

That's it. Three things. T.O. is NOT the problem in Dallas, and I'm sick of hearing it.

Yeah, eat my shorts dude.

 

[Big Dakota]

Any time.

I triple dog dare ya

 

[Dave_in-NC]

I don't want to read this whole thread, what number post did this guy blow up
in?:tantrum:

 

[JohnnyHopkins]

I don't want to read this whole thread, what number post did this guy blow up
in?:tantrum:

You saved yourself some time, I can't remember the post but the "payoff" was pretty weak. He promised TNT and then danced around with a sparkler as the payoff.

 

[TNCowboy]

Cowher is just talking out of his ***. No coach in their right mind would cut TO as soon as they where hired.

When TO was a free agent, no one else wanted him. When you consider that against how talented TO is, it's obvious a lot of teams felt the same way Cowher does.

Given the choice, I'd wager most new coaches would want TO gone. As talented as he is, no coach wants that challenge to his authority in the lockerroom. Like it or not, that's exactly what TO does.

 

[Dave_in-NC]

You saved yourself some time, I can't remember the post but the "payoff" was pretty weak. He promised TNT and then danced around with a sparkler as the payoff.

Thnx Joe, I figured as much.

 

[Dave_in-NC]

Cowher is just talking out of his ***. No coach in their right mind would cut TO as soon as they where hired.

Sooooo, he was just talking for the sake of talking?

 

[thechosen1n2]

Funny how other teams in the league are able to thrive and win championships without the benefit of his services, yet somehow he's indispensable to Dallas. Yep, very funny indeed.

no one said indispensable, just said he was not the problem, and he wasnt. The problem was the gameplan. Name a team (as good as Witten is) whose tight end was the go to guy who ever won anything. Some may think Denver and Shannon Sharpe but T Davis was the go to guy 1 and Sharpe was as fast as most wideout. Our offense leaves to many yards on the field.

 

[Bach]

Jerry said himself he loves the attention..

Jerry is more concerned with selling the cowboys brand.

Not winning games.

Can't argue with that.