What would happen if Dak stopped listening to the coaches?

[khiladi]

Linehan? Garrett? Please educate me on the difference between the way either of those two knuckleheads have run our offense.

Garrett would have Dak running 5-7 drops all day and trying to throw the ball downfield and would hardly run the ball and would be last in the league in play action..

Dak would have never survived what Romo did... Dak once he feels pressure, even in college, would carry it through, even when there was none..

 

[Kevinicus]

I disagree with every point. But of course you already know that.

Dak wasn't poisoned by our environment until he had a full offseason to absorb the dumbing down effect.

I don't think Dak was poisoned either. He's deficient. He's been figured out. There's no going back.

 

[Bleu Star]

Garrett would have Dak running 5-7 drops all day and trying to throw the ball downfield and would hardly run the ball and would be last in the league in play action..

Well sir. You are quite observant because I see no difference in today and what Garrett was trying to do 10 years ago. They both suck.

 

[Bleu Star]

I don't think Dak was poisoned either. He's deficient. He's been figured out. There's no going back.

Gotcha. Thanks.

 

[foofighters]

They also forget Tony Romo had Jason Garrett as his play caller and wasn’t allowed in game planning meetings until he got his new contract nor did he have Callahan and that all pro line developed my him with the running game a majority of his career, another guy Garrett grew jealous of and feuded with.

Clearly they also forget pro-bowl is voted by the fans and when the Dallas Cowboys have some success, they get a lot of players in the pro-bowl just on fandom alone. Also Being on America’s team is why a player like Dak earned the most endorsements of any NFL player in 2017, more than even guys like Brady..

All of these guys became pro bowl linemen because of Romo buying time. Leonard Davis was a bust before Romo, Guride couldn’t even call plays as center, Columbo was another journeyman and so so. This group, minus Davis allowed close to 50 sacks after Flozell Adams went down in like 2005 or 2006.

Our lineman currently are better than any group since our 90's teams. We may not have the TO or Witten in his prime but MBIII and co are near what Zeke and Co are. That defense with all the pro bowl stars were burned over and over again in December/January do I wouldn't really count them as all that special.

 

[tyke1doe]

Really ironic that Romo is now appreciated as being a really good and really smart QB due to his broadcasting career.

Speaking for myself, I never thought Romo was a dumb quarterback. He just made boneheaded mistakes at the most inopportune time, ala, Brett Favre. But he was immensely talented and smart. I think had Parcells and Sean Peyton stayed with him his entire career, he would have at least a Super Bowl appearance by now. Parcells was trying to harness his mistake-prone ability to match his abilities as a magician. But when Parcells left, essentially Wade and then Garrett let Romo run the show. And we had to put up with the Favrvian Romo - for good and for bad.

 

[Roadtrip635]

ah yes, the 13 pro bowlers conversation...don't drank that kool-aid...

Our defense had 20 INTs and almost 50 sacks that year. TO had 1400 yds, Witt had 1100+yds Barber was just shy of 1000yds splitting time with Julius. Ware had 14 sacks Ellis had 12.5 Flozell, Gurode and Columbo were still in their prime. Even Crayton had a nice year as the 3rd receiving option with 700/7 and we had Miles Austin riding the bench

I would gladly drink that kool-aid

 

[Roadtrip635]

They also forget Tony Romo had Jason Garrett as his play caller and wasn’t allowed in game planning meetings until he got his new contract nor did he have Callahan and that all pro line developed my him with the running game a majority of his career, another guy Garrett grew jealous of and feuded with.

Clearly they also forget pro-bowl is voted by the fans and when the Dallas Cowboys have some success, they get a lot of players in the pro-bowl just on fandom alone. Also Being on America’s team is why a player like Dak earned the most endorsements of any NFL player in 2017, more than even guys like Brady..

All of these guys became pro bowl linemen because of Romo buying time. Leonard Davis was a bust before Romo, Guride couldn’t even call plays as center, Columbo was another journeyman and so so. This group, minus Davis allowed close to 50 sacks after Flozell Adams went down in like 2005 or 2006.

There were six 1st or 2nd Team All-Pros that season and a couple more that were in the conversation. Ellis had 12.5 sacks and didn't even make 2nd team AP. Non of those APs was Romo. There was an abundance of talent on that team.

 

[foofighters]

Our defense had 20 INTs and almost 50 sacks that year. TO had 1400 yds, Witt had 1100+yds Barber was just shy of 1000yds splitting time with Julius. Ware had 14 sacks Ellis had 12.5 Flozell, Gurode and Columbo were still in their prime. Even Crayton had a nice year as the 3rd receiving option with 700/7 and we had Miles Austin riding the bench

I would gladly drink that kool-aid

and how did the winter do for us? Teams figured us out. Jason and Spirano were polishing their resume's while Saban was singing, "pig suey..." That whole team collapsed.

 

[khiladi]

Our lineman currently are better than any group since our 90's teams. We may not have the TO or Witten in his prime but MBIII and co are near what Zeke and Co are. That defense with all the pro bowl stars were burned over and over again in December/January do I wouldn't really count them as all that special.

We lost in that era, because our OC was incompetent. Even when we supposedly ran the ball (which we never did), we were last in play action passing, meaning it wasn’t even used by our resident Red Ginger to keep DBs and linemen second-guessing. We ran shotgun by the end of the Garrett era close to 80% of the time.

When we had talent, we had an idiot HC. And when Romo finally had the pieces and a decent play-caller in Linehan, they went with a change of pace backup QB.

 

[khiladi]

There were six 1st or 2nd Team All-Pros that season and a couple more that were in the conversation. Ellis had 12.5 sacks and didn't even make 2nd team AP. Non of those APs was Romo. There was an abundance of talent on that team.

You mean the same Ellis that couldn’t stop a screen pass against Detroit Lions when Wade wasn’t there? And the same defense that allowed Kitna to abuse this team and basically target Bradie James in passing situations and another LB in Ayodele that couldn’t run a 40 in under 5 seconds probably?

You mean the same team that almost put Parcells into retirement and his own former teammates were so worried about him they had to come down from NY o support him on the sidelines?

I’m not sure what you mean by talent? Wade compensated for a lot on our defense, but even he couldn’t compensate for the incompetence on display with Jacques Reeves and guys on their last leg like Anthony Henry who gave up like a 50 yard TD to Cooper on the get go against the Giants. Our LBs were slow as molasses and guys like Hamlin weee stop gaps to shore up our pathetic backfield.

These players basically became all-pro because of the success of the 13-3 season and nobody thought of them as all-Pro prior outside a guy like Ware and Witten and Flozell Adams.

And I don’t know how many times this needs repeating. 13-3 was when Sporano was still here babysitting Garrett and he left. And even then, by the end of the year our passing game was basically figured out and Garrett never recovered. They hid behind TOs high ankle sprain, but Garrett couldn’t even get Romo the franchise passing record that year in the last game of the season against the incompetent Commanders.

And once Sporano left it was even worse. Then Jerry leveraged a draft to get Roy Williams here to try and open up the offense for Garrett.

Dallas even tried bringing Sporano back when Garrett was struggling coaching the offense..

The point being, even if you argue we had talent, we were hamstrung by Jerry’s love for Garrett. In this era, Dak was surrounded by more than adequate pieces and was chucking pick 6s all day and he isn’t hamstrung by Garrett calling plays,

Say what you want, but Linehan is one thousand times the OC and playcaller Garrett is or was on his best day. Garrett was a LIABILITY when in full control of the offense.

 

[Roadtrip635]

and how did the winter do for us? Teams figured us out. Jason and Spirano were polishing their resume's while Saban was singing, "pig suey..." That whole team collapsed.

Now you're changing the subject, it was about the amount of talent Tony had his first whole season versus what Dak has now. We all know the results, but it wasn't because of lack of talent. There was a shocking amount of talent wasted. Ellis had 12.5 sacks and a DB with 6 INT and they couldn't crack the AP list. We had 3 DBs with at least 4 picks that season, how long has it been since we had a DB get 4 in one season? There was much more talent then than now, by a large margin.

 

[Bleu Star]

Our defense had 20 INTs and almost 50 sacks that year. TO had 1400 yds, Witt had 1100+yds Barber was just shy of 1000yds splitting time with Julius. Ware had 14 sacks Ellis had 12.5 Flozell, Gurode and Columbo were still in their prime. Even Crayton had a nice year as the 3rd receiving option with 700/7 and we had Miles Austin riding the bench

I would gladly drink that kool-aid

#MeToo

 

[Bleu Star]

and how did the winter do for us? Teams figured us out. Jason and Spirano were polishing their resume's while Saban was singing, "pig suey..." That whole team collapsed.

Your response has absolutely nothing to do with the original premise regarding whether or not Romo "had a talented team around him".

Sincerely,

Peanut Gallery

 

[Bleu Star]

We lost in that era, because our OC was incompetent. Even when we supposedly ran the ball (which we never did), we were last in play action passing, meaning it wasn’t even used by our resident Red Ginger to keep DBs and linemen second-guessing. We ran shotgun by the end of the Garrett era close to 80% of the time.

When we had talent, we had an idiot HC. And when Romo finally had the pieces and a decent play-caller in Linehan, they went with a change of pace backup QB.

So what's different between now and then?

 

[Roadtrip635]

You mean the same Ellis that couldn’t stop a screen pass against Detroit Lions when Wade wasn’t there? And the same defense that allowed Kitna to abuse this team and basically target Bradie James in passing situations and another LB in Ayodele that couldn’t run a 40 in under 5 seconds probably?

You mean the same team that almost put Parcells into retirement and his own former teammates were so worried about him they had to come down from NY o support him on the sidelines?

I’m not sure what you mean by talent? Wade compensated for a lot on our defense, but even he couldn’t compensate for the incompetence on display with Jacques Reeves and guys on their last leg like Anthony Henry who gave up like a 50 yard TD to Cooper on the get go against the Giants. Our LBs were slow as molasses and guys like Hamlin weee stop gaps to shore up our pathetic backfield.

These players basically became all-pro because of the success of the 13-3 season and nobody thought of them as all-Pro prior outside a guy like Ware and Witten and Flozell Adams.

And I don’t know how many times this needs repeating. 13-3 was when Sporano was still here babysitting Garrett and he left. And even then, by the end of the year our passing game was basically figured out and Garrett never recovered. They hid behind TOs high ankle sprain, but Garrett couldn’t even get Romo the franchise passing record that year in the last game of the season against the incompetent Commanders.

And once Sporano left it was even worse. Then Jerry leveraged a draft to get Roy Williams here to try and open up the offense for Garrett.

Dallas even tried bringing Sporano back when Garrett was struggling coaching the offense..

The point being, even if you argue we had talent, we were hamstrung by Jerry’s love for Garrett. In this era, Dak was surrounded by more than adequate pieces and was chucking pick 6s all day and he isn’t hamstrung by Garrett calling plays,

Say what you want, but Linehan is one thousand times the OC and playcaller Garrett is or was on his best day. Garrett was a LIABILITY when in full control of the offense.

Having that talent and utilizing that talent aren't the same. Garrett rode Sparano's coattails and yes we were hamstrung by Garrett and he couldn't continue to evolve the scheme and we became very predictable, we could move the ball up and down the field, but thanks to JG struggled in the RZ. Flozell, Gurode, Davis and Colombo were all very good lineman at the time and we had Barber that was a good battering ram then, but refused to run when necessary. JG squandered that talent like he's done with others since. The talent was there, but even with the talent, you have to have competent coaching. That team seriously underachieved and Garrett indeed had a hand in that.

 

[jrumann59]

The biggest thing is being a QB in the nfl is huge climb upward. Players with sound mechanics develop faster usually because they can focus on nuance of the game. Romo benefited from Parcells, Peyton, and the parade of Stiffs they marched through here as gap QBs. Testeverde was great for Romo when it came to the mechanics and Romo sitting on PS or in the back up role focusing on mechanic work and nuances. Once he was starter he had very few holes mechanically and started to understand the game. I really think Dak should have sat his second year, I know teams fall in love when their young QB lights it up but Dak has many issues fundamentally with his mechanics and reading the defenses.

 

[JDSmith]

It has always seemed to me that when Dak got more responsibility in the offense he started to struggle more. As a rookie he was just going out there and running the play, with very little audible or check outs or anything - line up, call for the ball and do what you are supposed to do. And with a lot of roll outs and limited reads. I thought that in his second year they gave him more responsibility, he's doing a lot more at the LoS and he's not reading half the field as often. And his play has declined. I'm not sure, and I haven't gone back to watch his rookie season, but that was the impression I got.

If that's the case then I don't see how giving him more freedom, and by extension responsibility, would fix his problems.

 

[xwalker]

I wonder what would happen if Dak stopped listening to the idiocy/coaching/noise/whatever you want to call it in his ear and just started doing his own thing like in his rookie season?

Thoughts?

As mentioned elsewhere, Romo started ignoring the coaches and it worked out pretty well for him.

I'll say it once more, when Dak was playing wide open in his rookie season before the "dumbing down" effect started, he was decisive, care free, and effective.

Will it take him taking a bold step in defining his career (just like Romo did) to save it?

Romo only had Garrett as the OC to overcome. Wade had zero involvement on offense. Romo also had Witten backing him 100%.

Dak has Linehan and Garrett to deal with and he does not have the receiver (WR/TE) that has a tight bond with him like Witten/Romo and Irvin/Aikman.

 

[glimmerman]

Need to get Linehan the hell out of here. It's like watching paint dry.

Have to instal a whole new Offense and would be a year of learning it. Can’t get anything done any more in TC. A lot of jogging around and stretching. After last year I really trusted this staff was doing what they said in putting in a lot of new stuff. Did you see anything really new? Besides players.