BTB: Cowboys 2013 Draft Board Leaked... All Seven Rounds (Link Post #21) *Merge*

[DFWJC]

I expect that most teams end up with that sort of draft. If you are really bad at this, you can easily rack up tons of selections of guys who you have high grades on that end up falling (because other teams don't have them graded highly)

Yep.
Can't say I've ever heard a GM say afer the draft "we were horrible and got terrible value this year".

They all love their drafts immediately after the fact....or at least they say they do.

 

[JBS]

Jerry is a bit busted here, after claiming that had Frederick with a first-round grade at 22 or whatever. Obviously, they had him in the second round.

Wrong.

We had him at 21 or 22...whatever it was.

Doesn't mean we had a first round grade on him.

We only had 18 players with first round grades

 

[xwalker]

Garrett was right, either take Floyd or get more in the trade. Jerry was just so obsessed with trading in the first place that he wasn't going to listen to anyone. He is the big bad boss.

So dumb!

The #1 problem with the 2012 season was the lack of a run blocking Center. It is no coincidence that the Cowboys best game running the ball was the 1 complete game that Costa played.

Without a running game, defenses would sell out defending the pass (pass rush and coverage). This forced Romo into many high risk situations.

High risks throws by Romo resulted in more interceptions.

Ineffective running game combined with increased interceptions caused the defense to be on the field longer.

Marinelli and Kiffin did not have a high opinion of Floyd. The draft board was created by the scouts. There are no scouts on earth that know more about the requirements of a DLineman for Kiffin's defense than Marinelli and Kiffin.

Drafting Frederick was not a dumb move.

 

[AbeBeta]

Jerry is a bit busted here, after claiming that had Frederick with a first-round grade at 22 or whatever. Obviously, they had him in the second round.

No, I clearly heard him talk about how we had a 2nd round grade on Frederick

 

[coult44]

Let me sum this up for y'all that seem to have forgotten the LAST TWO DECADES...JJ and the rest of his horrific scout team have been the worst drafting team in pro sports....If you look at this board and compare it to the teams who have willingly put their boards on display, it completely spells out the definition of a LOSING FRANCHISE.....EVERYONE knows we completely got hosed in the 1st round trade. EVERYONE knows Frederick was a complete reach. Even if he turns out to be our 2nd best OL, we could have got him in the 2nd or even 3rd round according to all the draft gurus. Sure we might have hit on Williams, and in 3 years we might have a solid contributor in Escobar or maybeeee Wilcox. But how many of these guys won't even be on the team? JJ's draft history is beyond horrible. Why in the hell some of y'all try to defend it and forget about the crap teams that he's put on the field for the last 18 years is beyond me...This research and work that someone put together was to do nothing more than prove exactly that. If anyone thought this was done to solidify or give JJ kudos for his drafting ability, you are so far out of touch that I might believe you are on his publicity team....

 

[TheCount]

Wrong.

We had him at 21 or 22...whatever it was.

Doesn't mean we had a first round grade on him.

We only had 18 players with first round grades

I don't think the board works that way.

Being 21 or 22 doesn't mean you have him rated as a 1st rounder. 1st round grades only applied to the first 18 names in this case. Our last first round grade was on Lotulelei.

 

[AbeBeta]

Yep.
Can't say I've ever heard a GM say afer the draft "we were horrible and got terrible value this year".

They all love their drafts immediately after the fact....or at least they say they do.

I swear I must have heard Jerry say five or six times now "we tried to move up into the first to get him, we were lucky that he fell to us in the 2nd."

 

[ThreeandOut]

Yes, one report indicated that the issue was that Garrett thought that they should get more in the trade.

Getting more in this case probably meant not trading down as far as they did with San Francisco. But the targets under either trade were probably the same.

 

[xwalker]

Let me sum this up for y'all that seem to have forgotten the LAST TWO DECADES...JJ and the rest of his horrific scout team have been the worst drafting team in pro sports....If you look at this board and compare it to the teams who have willingly put their boards on display, it completely spells out the definition of a LOSING FRANCHISE.....EVERYONE knows we completely got hosed in the 1st round trade. EVERYONE knows Frederick was a complete reach. Even if he turns out to be our 2nd best OL, we could have got him in the 2nd or even 3rd round according to all the draft gurus. Sure we might have hit on Williams, and in 3 years we might have a solid contributor in Escobar or maybeeee Wilcox. But how many of these guys won't even be on the team? JJ's draft history is beyond horrible. Why in the hell some of y'all try to defend it and forget about the crap teams that he's put on the field for the last 18 years is beyond me...This research and work that someone put together was to do nothing more than prove exactly that. If anyone thought this was done to solidify or give JJ kudos for his drafting ability, you are so far out of touch that I might believe you are on his publicity team....

1. There has been research posted in the past that showed that the Cowboys have not been the worst drafting team in the NFL.

2. Draft "gurus" are just trying to guess where NFL teams will draft players. When the draft "guru" is correct, they give the NFL teams that caused them to be correct an A+ grade on the pick. When an NFL team proves the "guru" incorrect, then the "guru" labels that pick as either a reach or value based on which direction the "guru" missed on the pick.

3. This research was done by a website that is composed of Cowboys fans. It appears that they were trying to provide information to their readers that the media had not provided. They don't appear to be trying to prove anything in regards to Jerry.

 

[reddyuta]

what constitutes a successful draft? is it getting 2 starters and some role players from it ? is that good enough?.

 

[DFWJC]

what constitutes a successful draft? is it getting 2 starters and some role players from it ? is that good enough?.

Good question.

And, as you can guess, it depends on many things:
How many picks you had
Where your picks were
How good were the players you got
How good were the players you passed on
etc.

If you got two "starters" and they are the equivalent of Doug Free and Gerald Sensabaugh, but you passed on an Aaron Rodgers or JJ Watt...well, that's not so good.

As they say, time will tell.

 

[BIGDen]

I hated trading down that far and getting so little in return. I hated passing on Floyd. However, after seeing the draft board, the moves were totally understandable. Not only that, it really worked out well in the end. To get 3 of our top 25 players is amazing. We got 5 of our top 50 and 6 of our top 67. We got 5 players with 2nd or 3rd round grades despite not going into this draft with a boatload of picks. Trading down as far as they did and getting only a 3rd in return could've blown up in their faces, but it didn't. In fact, they seemed to take calculated risks throughout the draft that worked out in their favor. Taking Escobar over Williams and still getting Williams a round later, for example. Dallas has reason to be happy with their haul IMO. What a great bit of info for diehards like us!

Travis Frederick [2, 22]
Gavin Escobar [2, 25]
Terrance WIlliams [2, 23]
J. J. Wilcox [3, 50]
B. W. Webb [3, 47]
Joseph Randle [3, 67]
DeVonte Holloman [5, 147]

 

[Cumart21]

Let's hope the scouts were right, haha.

 

[Floatyworm]

I thought all along something strange went on with Floyd.

I will say this, at least according to Dallas' board, they got two top 25 players in return for that 18th pick.

Still, passing on a top 5 ranked talent (according your own team's board) at 18 is crazy.

Agreed.....

Just goes to show what happens when your GM puts going to the X-games to watch snow mobiles ahead of the combine/Sr Bowl.

You get decisions like this.....

Totally cuts the legs out from your scouting dept....and head coach.

I'll say this...Jerry deserves every sleepless night he has because he is his own worst enemy

 

[Chuck 54]

We didn't pass on a highly rated Floyd for lower rated Frederick just because our need for OL was great.

We passed on a highly rated Floyd in order to trade down for a highly rated OL + a 3rd round pick we wanted to recoup.

We did a two for one deal, and when that happens, you pass on several players that are higher rated than your first pick, but the comparison must be the one player versus the two.

Otherwise every trade down would be stupid.

 

[jterrell]

Let me sum this up for y'all that seem to have forgotten the LAST TWO DECADES...JJ and the rest of his horrific scout team have been the worst drafting team in pro sports....If you look at this board and compare it to the teams who have willingly put their boards on display, it completely spells out the definition of a LOSING FRANCHISE.....EVERYONE knows we completely got hosed in the 1st round trade. EVERYONE knows Frederick was a complete reach. Even if he turns out to be our 2nd best OL, we could have got him in the 2nd or even 3rd round according to all the draft gurus. Sure we might have hit on Williams, and in 3 years we might have a solid contributor in Escobar or maybeeee Wilcox. But how many of these guys won't even be on the team? JJ's draft history is beyond horrible. Why in the hell some of y'all try to defend it and forget about the crap teams that he's put on the field for the last 18 years is beyond me...This research and work that someone put together was to do nothing more than prove exactly that. If anyone thought this was done to solidify or give JJ kudos for his drafting ability, you are so far out of touch that I might believe you are on his publicity team....

lets tackle the obvious factual errors 1st:

all the draft gurus have not said we could have gotten him Frederick at 47.
In fact just look at my sig.
You can also check basically every other review of the draft.
They may suggest Frederick was a reach but also acknowledge the OL were all going higher than predicted and there is ZERO indication Frederick falls to 47.

18 years? Jerry has been GM for 25 years. He certainly may have been the rubber stamper for Jimmy but he held the title form day 1. Even after Jerry left that was 20 years ago not 18. Ahhh... I get it. We only count when the Boys started rebuilding after Troy/Mike retired.

draft research of all 32 teams have NOTHING TO DO WITH JERRY. It is about comparing all 32 teams. The fact Dallas doesn't come close to finishing last doesn't fit your agenda so you might as well ignore it as you have done all other facts that don't meet the agenda.

Other than those minor factual errors good post. we need more like it.

 

[MonsterD]

what constitutes a successful draft? is it getting 2 starters and some role players from it ? is that good enough?.

I would say if there are 2 starters after the initial contract of say 4-5 years, then yes that is something of a success in beating the odds. Now if you get one more or if even one of those 2 are multiple years at the top third of their respective position, then that is a great draft.

 

[cowboyz]

tobefair marinelli and kiffen were hired late, so who knows if that was a grade for their defense

 

[jterrell]

Agreed.....

Just goes to show what happens when your GM puts going to the X-games to watch snow mobiles ahead of the combine/Sr Bowl.

You get decisions like this.....

Totally cuts the legs out from your scouting dept....and head coach.

I'll say this...Jerry deserves every sleepless night he has because he is his own worst enemy

ROFL. This is awesome.

Jerry made this decision not because the defensive coaches told him they didn't really like Floyd that much and had no plans to start him in this defense but because he missed the Senior Bowl like about half the GMs in the NFL? --they generally show and watch a couple days practice then leave. others arrive late and watch the last couple days and maybe the game. very few stay in mobile the entire time.

I hated the move at the time because I saw Floyd there too but also openly acknowledged I had hoped Floyd went before Richardson because Richardson was the fit in this defense.

The move is hardly some crazy leap given all the facts.
We badly needed interior OL. The interior OL flew off the board to the point we had 3 guys left with starting grades on them. You need r1 guys to start for you under this new CBA. And Dallas especially does with its high priced guys locked in. Floyd wasn't a day 1 starter here. Great upside but simply not expected to be better than Hatcher or Ratliff day 1.
So you take Floyd for his overall grade but then have to watch him rotate in as a rookie while you continue to play Costa, Bern. Livings as the G-C-G.

Yea that woulda been a sweet draft plan.

Jerry has done really stupid things. Trading a fortune for Galloway who was basically only worried about getting paid. Then repeating the mistake with RW11. Hiring Poodle and placing personnel in Lacewell's hands. Long list of really major offenses. Not that hard to focus on those real issues.

 

[CyberB0b]

Let's hope the scouts were right, haha.

Yes because it could mean our "success" was due to a poor draft board that was out of line with the rest of the league.