Dak is not a Franchise QB

uvaballa

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,964
Reaction score
4,697
Zeke didn’t do much? What were you watching? He rushed for over 125 yards and a TD and pretty much was involved in every successful drive. Plus Dez played lights out in the second half..
Zeke didn’t do much? What were you watching? He rushed for over 125 yards and a TD and pretty much was involved in every successful drive. Plus Dez played lights out in the second half..

Sorry used wrong wording there. Dak did most of the work and Zeke had a good game. No way you can say the cowboys rode Zeke in that game. Dan went head to head with one of the best and the D failed in the last second.
 

Skillit

Well-Known Member
Messages
428
Reaction score
350
Factors over the last 3 seasons of Dak and Z:

First- pinnacle of O line dominance
Dez / Witten present
First year of new philosophy/ league hadn’t adjusted

Year 2- litany of O line issues/ injuries
Zeke drama and suspension
Sean Lee injury - defense implodes

This year
No Witten or Dez
T Fred hurt
Rookie G too weak
Less O line dominance = Less Zeke dominance
No real talent / target in passing game
League knows the blueprint all too well.

I’m a Dak fan- but he’s not anywhere near a polished QB. He’s proven he’ll take care of the ball and play within the system, but the other parts have to be there.


Right now- they aren’t. I don’t see how this is an indictment of a 4th round draft pick.
 

khiladi

Well-Known Member
Messages
36,529
Reaction score
36,658
Sorry used wrong wording there. Dak did most of the work and Zeke had a good game. No way you can say the cowboys rode Zeke in that game. Dan went head to head with one of the best and the D failed in the last second.

GBs defensive backfield was decimated, with backup scrubs and they were allowing 400 yard games to end the season.

On the drive that Dallas started at their own 10 in the 4th to score a TD, Zeke touches it five times. In the third, the drive Dallas moved the ball from their own 25 to GBs 19, when Dak threw the INT, Zeke touched the ball 4 times out of 8 and had a 22 yarder on the first down.

And like I said, that game was with Dez Bryant who caught 9 passes out of 12 and he’s no longer here.
 

Aviano90

Go Seahawks!!!
Messages
16,758
Reaction score
24,485
Zeke didn’t do much? What were you watching? He rushed for over 125 yards and a TD and pretty much was involved in every successful drive. Plus Dez played lights out in the second half..
Zeke did not score a TD that game.
 

uvaballa

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,964
Reaction score
4,697
Yes I think the main reason the offense is struggling is due to the oline. Zeke and Dak will look better with better blocking no doubt.

I just don’t understand why Zeke gets a pass and Dak doesn’t especially since they don’t have a #1 WR.

I think Dak is a middle of the road QB and my expectations aren’t as high for him as other top picks on the team.
 

Aviano90

Go Seahawks!!!
Messages
16,758
Reaction score
24,485
Haha good catch. I didn’t feel like looking it up but he was trying to make Zeke look better.
Zeke had a great game, was just under-utilized. We needed to pound the ball, especially early and establish dominance. We also rarely ran on short yardage or in the red zone. Dak was awesome though, and I don't care if the defense was hurt. Romo couldn't take advantage of a banged up Giants secondary in 2007, so I'm not going to knock Dak for taking advantage and having a good game.
 

khiladi

Well-Known Member
Messages
36,529
Reaction score
36,658
Haha good catch. I didn’t feel like looking it up but he was trying to make Zeke look better.

I clearly did make him look better with his rushing for 125 yards, including touching the ball 4 out of 8 tunes in the third moving the ball from Dallas territory to GB 19, when Dak threw the INT..
 

khiladi

Well-Known Member
Messages
36,529
Reaction score
36,658
Zeke had a great game, was just under-utilized. We needed to pound the ball, especially early and establish dominance. We also rarely ran on short yardage or in the red zone. Dak was awesome though, and I don't care if the defense was hurt. Romo couldn't take advantage of a banged up Giants secondary in 2007, so I'm not going to knock Dak for taking advantage and having a good game.

Giants defense was not allowing multiple 400 yard games to end the season. And the Giants has a stout DL and Crayton dropped a wide open pass and our offense was stagnating with Jason Garrett anyways, but we were hiding behind the “TO high ankle sprain” excuse..

But yeah that was one of Dak’s best games, and Dez’s as well with Dak.. and Zeke was running really well that game and was a major factor.
 

Aviano90

Go Seahawks!!!
Messages
16,758
Reaction score
24,485
Giants defense was not allowing multiple 400 yard games to end the season. And the Giants has a stout DL and Crayton dropped a wide open pass and our offense was stagnating with Jason Garrett anyways, but we were hiding behind the “TO high ankle sprain” excuse..

But yeah that was one of Dak’s best games, and Dez’s as well with Dak..
And Romo missed a wide open Terrell Owens on 3rd down in the red zone forcing us to settle for a FG, in which Owens should have scored a TD. The ball was wildly thrown side-armed high and behind TO. He also took a bad sack and then a grounding penalty later. The Giants secondary was already banged up and they lost Aaron Ross early in the game.
 

ABQCOWBOY

Regular Joe....
Messages
58,929
Reaction score
27,716
Zeke didn’t do much? What were you watching? He rushed for over 125 yards and a TD and pretty much was involved in every successful drive. Plus Dez played lights out in the second half..

I have to agree with the other poster, to a certain extent. Now I will admit that there were not a lot of snaps to go around in the first half for either player but watch that game again and take notice of Carolina's Defense.
Of course and Dak hasn’t shown any consistent ability to throw the ball downfield and until he does, he’s going to be the main problem. Teams so far (aka Carolina) are loading the box on 2nd and 17 this year and daring Dak to throw deep.

He's not the main problem Khiladi. He is along for the ride. I am not one of those Dak holy war guys. I wasn't with Tony or anybody else either. I told everybody, before the draft that I thought Dak was not very accurate and was not at all sure he could be effective as a Starter in the NFL. I am, however a guy who has seen enough football to understand where the problem is on this Football team.

It is not with the young QB. You can't even start to evaluate him until you can get a solid base in there for him to work with. Do injuries happen? Sure they do and you have to play through them and execute but you shouldn't be starting the season off with the things we are seeing today. Those things are all correctable yet we didn't correct any of them in the off season. You can't hold a young player accountable for the failures of the Coaching Staff or the Front Office. That's what bad franchises do. Teams like New England, they don't do that. If they had, a 6th round pick like Tom Brady, who couldn't run at all, who can barely move, who is as slow as molasses in winter, would never have had a chance to become what he is today. I'm not saying Dak is the guy but I am saying that you can't know if he is or if he isn't when the team is screwing things up from the jump. If you watched Dak in College, you had to know that he was not a prototypical NFL QB. You had to understand what his strengths were and were not. If you know this, then how do you come to the conclusion that he can be Tom Brady in his third year? I mean, that is just stupid, to expect that, yet I feel like that's exactly what many expect, including this coaching staff. You don't put it all on him. You fix what you need to to allow our strength to make a difference.

We can't know what he is until this team is at least stable enough to see how he performs under manageable conditions. At least, thats what I think.
 

uvaballa

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,964
Reaction score
4,697
I clearly did make him look better with his rushing for 125 yards, including touching the ball 4 out of 8 tunes in the third moving the ball from Dallas territory to GB 19, when Dak threw the INT..
Dak played better than Zeke hands down. Stop being a hater.

BTW I’m not a Dak fanboy or hater. I just don’t understand why Zeke always get a free ride even when he got suspended.
 

ABQCOWBOY

Regular Joe....
Messages
58,929
Reaction score
27,716
Factors over the last 3 seasons of Dak and Z:

First- pinnacle of O line dominance
Dez / Witten present
First year of new philosophy/ league hadn’t adjusted

Year 2- litany of O line issues/ injuries
Zeke drama and suspension
Sean Lee injury - defense implodes

This year
No Witten or Dez
T Fred hurt
Rookie G too weak
Less O line dominance = Less Zeke dominance
No real talent / target in passing game
League knows the blueprint all too well.

I’m a Dak fan- but he’s not anywhere near a polished QB. He’s proven he’ll take care of the ball and play within the system, but the other parts have to be there.


Right now- they aren’t. I don’t see how this is an indictment of a 4th round draft pick.

This is fair man.
 

khiladi

Well-Known Member
Messages
36,529
Reaction score
36,658
And Romo missed a wide open Terrell Owens on 3rd down in the red zone forcing us to settle for a FG, in which Owens should have scored a TD. The ball was wildly thrown side-armed high and behind TO. He also took a bad sack and then a grounding penalty later. The Giants secondary was already banged up and they lost Aaron Ross early in the game.

Fasano dropped a TD right in his hand on the 2nd and 7, Flozell had a false start putting them in 3rd and 12. At 1:13.. and your right.. that was overthrown from what Romo felt like pressure.

But there is no way you can compare the two defenses..

 

Haimerej

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,083
Reaction score
6,776
I just don’t buy the teams don’t respect the QB so we can’t run. I’ve seen it too many times. AP produced a 2000 yard season with Christian Ponder. Jamal Lewis has a 2000 yard season with Kyle Booker starting 9 games(rookie no one respected). Thomas Jones had a very good rushing season with Rex Grossman (last Bears SB).

If Zeke is as special as fans say he should do more. No more excuses for him. I agree he needs more carries (25-30) but he has to be better too!

They still can run. But when compared to 2016, it's tougher sledding. Again, Zeke is putting up comparable averages but he only got 15 carries last week.
 

khiladi

Well-Known Member
Messages
36,529
Reaction score
36,658
Dak played better than Zeke hands down. Stop being a hater.

BTW I’m not a Dak fanboy or hater. I just don’t understand why Zeke always get a free ride even when he got suspended.

He got suspended for what he did pre-draft if I remember correctly.. not sure what relevance that has..

And I’m not sure how you can qualify Dak playing better than Zeke. If you argue he has more an impact, of course he’s the QB. But Zeke’s impact was clearly evident in the second half when Dallas moved the ball with a heavy dose of Zeke.

And just as Dak being all world would have more of an impact on a team than an all world RB, because Dak is the QB, hes also the primary reason why we suck offensively.

He’s the QB and QBs have more impact overall..
 

Aviano90

Go Seahawks!!!
Messages
16,758
Reaction score
24,485
Fasano dropped a TD right in his hand on the 2nd and 7, Flozell had a false start putting them in 3rd and 12. At 1:13.. and your right.. that was overthrown from what Romo felt like pressure.

But there is no way you can compare the two defenses..


I will rewatch when I get home, but when I viewed the game months ago, the pass to Fasano looked like a pass defensed instead of a drop. People were claiming Fasano was wide open, alone in the end zone is what made me go back and look at the play again. But I'll look at it again and see if there is a clearer angle.
 

khiladi

Well-Known Member
Messages
36,529
Reaction score
36,658
I will rewatch when I get home, but when I viewed the game months ago, the pass to Fasano looked like a pass defensed instead of a drop. People were claiming Fasano was wide open, alone in the end zone is what made me go back and look at the play again. But I'll look at it again and see if there is a clearer angle.

Buck and Aikman said it was well-defended and they then showed the replay and Buck was like, Fasano just dropped it. That’s probably what caused the original confusion. Romo hits Fasano right in the upper left chest, where the defender couldn’t get it.
 

aria

Well-Known Member
Messages
17,543
Reaction score
16,793
and went 8 and 8 three times in a row when that OC went on to become HC.
Didn’t help when Fragile Tony went down in 2013 with ~a week left and Orton was the back up QB for a win and in game against Philthy. It’s amazing we came as close to beating them as we did with him as the back up. BTW, Orton had better stats in this game then Romo did against Philthy earlier in the year which is more of a testament to coaching.

Last time I checked, JG didn’t go 20 for 37 and throw 3 INT’s, one of which was on the final drive that would have given us the lead with barely any time left but resulted in a Washington TD instead (courtesy of your boy Tony Romo). That was for another win and in game in 2012.

The other year you reference we got beat for yet another win and in game aganst the team that went on to win the Super Bowl, the Gnats.
 
Top