JFK Assassination...Your Honest Thoughts

RS12

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blindzebra;3888753 said:
The open dictabelt was shown to be false so no there is no audio recording.

You know the trouble with all the conspiracy "facts" you keep throwing out?

One, they are not facts. There is no evidence to support any of it.

Two, they are put out by people interested in making a buck.

And what it adds up to is regardless of how many concrete facts and overwhelming evidence of the truth presented all that comes back is yeah but...followed by yet another manufactured argument.

First of all the HSCA spent two years on this and they looked at alot more than a dictabelt. You seem to want to jump over multiple eye witness accounts of what happened that dont fit your view. Then you talk about manufactured evidence. What about your jet effect.:laugh2: I'll go with a generally accepted scientific principal, an object in motion stays in motion through tansference of energy. You believe what you want and I'll believe my eyes.
 

Hostile

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CowboyDan;3888787 said:
I think the words of the guy who was standing right next the limo as it passed make a lot of sense, when he said the 3rd shot came from the grassy knoll area. So is it safe to say that there are differing accounts of how many shots were fired and of where they were coming from?

By the way, here's a great link to all the Warren Commission's evidence. You guys should really enjoy this.... http://jfkassassination.net/russ/wcexlink.htm
I have always admitted the # of shots and differing accounts was troublesome.

What I refuse to ignore however is the forensic evidence that does not support a shot from that area. People want me to believe that on this day and this man's head that the laws of science, inertia, and ballistics changed. I'm sorry, but they do not.

In those days cameras had flashbulbs that popped and smoked when pictures were taken. It could have easily been a camera bulb that some people saw as the actual shot was heard and they made an honest mistake.

I keep asking this but no one addresses it. Why did people run up the stairs by the knoll if they thought a shooter was there?
 

Hostile

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RS12;3888789 said:
First of all the HSCA spent two years on this and they looked at alot more than a dictabelt. You seem to want to jump over multiple eye witness accounts of what happened that dont fit your view. Then you talk about manufactured evidence. What about your jet effect.:laugh2: I'll go with a generally accepted scientific principal, an object in motion stays in motion through tansference of energy. You believe what you want and I'll believe my eyes.
Exactly the point I have been making. How did the bullet allegedly fired form the knoll evaporate? How did the back left of Kennedy's head not explode? How did the bullet stop inside his skull and go undetected? How did the bullet not hit Mrs. Kennedy? How did it not hit the grass to the left of the limo?

Impossible.
 

blindzebra

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RS12;3888789 said:
First of all the HSCA spent two years on this and they looked at alot more than a dictabelt. You seem to want to jump over multiple eye witness accounts of what happened that dont fit your view. Then you talk about manufactured evidence. What about your jet effect.:laugh2: I'll go with a generally accepted scientific principal, an object in motion stays in motion through tansference of energy. You believe what you want and I'll believe my eyes.

Believe what you want but you are wrong. Gotta love how you belittle the jet effect and then use the exact reason why it is true.

When matter expels it imparts energy so that motion is being acted upon.

As far as your eyes...I suggest actually seeing what the Zapruder film shows at the moment the bullet strikes and not a split second later.

At 313 you can clearly see the front, right side of his head explode. His head snaps forward...use your bodies in motion here...then as the force of the explosive matter going up and forward he moves back.
 

Viper

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Hostile;3888782 said:
From the Kennedy Library and Museum here are all of his speeches. They are separated by the years he made them. There are a lot in 1960 because he was campaigning. If you go to September 12, 1960 (page 4 of the 1960 speeches) and see one he made to the Greater Houston Ministerial Association, I believe it will be that speech.

According to that site the last speech he made was also in Houston, but it was a dedication of an aerospace medical center.

They also show the 2 speeches he would have made in Dallas and then in Austin that evening.

Thanks Hos, you are right.
 

Dodger12

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RS12;3888789 said:
First of all the HSCA spent two years on this and they looked at alot more than a dictabelt. You seem to want to jump over multiple eye witness accounts of what happened that dont fit your view. Then you talk about manufactured evidence. What about your jet effect.:laugh2: I'll go with a generally accepted scientific principal, an object in motion stays in motion through tansference of energy. You believe what you want and I'll believe my eyes.

Why do you refer to the HSCA and then nullify it's findings? Or so you just like to cherry pick certain "facts" that fit into your theory and disregard the others? Which one of the below findings from the HSCA do you not agree with?

1. That LHO fired three shots at the president with the second and third hitting him and the third killing him.

2. The shots that killed the president were fired from the 6th floor of the TSBD.

3. LHO owned the gun that was used to kill the president from the 6th floor of the TSBD

4. LHO had access to and was present on the 6th floor of the TSBD shortly before the assassination.

In essence, the HSCA is claiming that Oswald killed the president.
 

Hostile

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Viper;3888802 said:
Thanks Hos, you are right.
It had to happen sooner or later right?

:grin:

I found the footage of the photographer James Altgens. His testimony has always resonated with me.

[youtube]1t4ZAZix9hY[/youtube]

Also a man who watched Oswald fire shots. His description of Oswald led to Officer Tippit stopping him in the first place.

[youtube]BezYOOa8_LE[/youtube]
 

blindzebra

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Found this about the sound recording the House Assassinations Committee used to reach it's conclusion of a Grassy Knoll shot.


http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/odell/

And as I mentioned earlier the head of that committee said years later that had they known the recording was not made during the assassination that they would have reached the same conclusion that the Warren Commission did that Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone.
 

blindzebra

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Knoll shot

[youtube]9RCX3RdVHqo[/youtube]


6th floor shot

[youtube]_RX2phbWmgA[/youtube]
 

blindzebra

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Working the rifle in 8.4 seconds impossible?

[youtube]qevLWsg6EyA[/youtube]
 

arglebargle

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blindzebra;3889025 said:
Working the rifle in 8.4 seconds impossible?

[youtube]qevLWsg6EyA[/youtube]

Didn't have much time to re-sight and aim, did he? Nice for what it is, graphic example of what must have happened, if the Oswald theory is correct.
 

blindzebra

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arglebargle;3889059 said:
Didn't have much time to re-sight and aim, did he? Nice for what it is, graphic example of what must have happened, if the Oswald theory is correct.

The limo is going about 8 miles a hour and moving down in away from him so it is not that difficult.

And remember there is some wiggle room on the timing because we only have the reaction to the first shot of a photographer snapping a photo from across the street from Zapruder to base it on.

And as was shown in the clip, the witnesses described it as bang.....bang.........bang. So he missed, took a little more time and hit, but missed a kill shot, took a little more time and then the head shot.
 

Hostile

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arglebargle;3889059 said:
Didn't have much time to re-sight and aim, did he? Nice for what it is, graphic example of what must have happened, if the Oswald theory is correct.
He also did it by bringing the rifle down. I can do it with keeping the rifle pointed in the right direction which is far more time to aim.
 

CowboyDan

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Well you guys sure put up some videos today! I got a lot more yardwork done than y'all did though. :p:
The videos are good and Beyond the Magic Bullet is a very convincing show, no doubt. I have a couple comments on all of the video clips. Take them for what they're worth.
The eye witness vids are very convincing, but I was told earlier that we shouldn't present anything from someone who's getting paid for their statements. I guess the thinking is that some people will say anything for a buck. I can understand that theory. My other issues with those videos are as follows:
James Altgens clearly states that officers ran up the grassy knoll to apprehend the shooter. As much as I want to believe average Joe's and what their ears tell them, I lean towards the ears of people who get shot at more often than average Joe's.......cops.

Howard Brennan's interview is very convincing, but I just can't, for the life of me, figure out why he was watching the shooter the entire time. Call me crazy, but isn't that like watching the shooter of a jumpshot in a basketball game, even after he's released the ball? Don't you usually follow the shot to see if he makes it? Also, I don't know about you, but if I'm standing as close as he was to the guy who's shooting at our President, I'm not standing around watching all 3. I'm out of there, taking cover. Who knows though...maybe he actually did see history. Amazing if he did.

As for the Lattimer video, I have nothing more to add than what's already been said. No one has ever said you can't operate the bolt action on that gun in 8.3 seconds. If you don't believe me, re-read this entire thread.

Ok, back to Beyond the Magic Bullet. We've already gone through some issues I had with segments of this program, so I'm not going to repeat myself. However, you introduced more clips from the show, so here's my problem with them:

I am disappointed by the horrible angle that they use for the grassy knoll shot. However, now I understand why some of you keep repeating that Jackie would've been hit. I agree completely, at that angle, she would've been hit. They're using the spot where they think the Badgeman shows up on the Muchmore film. I've never supported that photo enhancement. I even said that earlier in this thread when someone was commenting on enhanced videos and photos.
This goes back to my earlier complaint about this grassy knoll shot. They pay no respect to the entry/exit wounds on the skull. They just say "hit it somewhere above the eye." What should've been done, was they should've drawn a straight line from the exit/entry rooms to the grassy knoll....that's where the grassy knoll shooter was, if he exists. This is obvious. It's not like we don't know where it went in and out at. I've been to the knoll. They were standing at a horrible angle.
The second problem I have with it is that on their 6th floor shot the head never snaps back and to the left. They go through all this trouble to replicate a human body, with a stiff yet flexible neck, and it never even makes a slight motion back and to the left. Interesting.
And finally, may I draw your attention to 8:30 in to the 2nd clip....where they attempt to show how similar their blood splatter pattern is to the Zapruder film's splatter. Does anyone else think it's completely different? or am I just crazy? I mean their's dumps forward and the actual splatter from the Zapruder film goes almost straight up, some forward, and some back. C'mon.
 

CowboyDan

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Hostile;3889081 said:
He also did it by bringing the rifle down. I can do it with keeping the rifle pointed in the right direction which is far more time to aim.

He's using a Carcano. You're not.......yet. ;)
 

Yeagermeister

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I have never seen the Zapruder film and not sure I want to but the footage shown in the various video shows IMO and as many of you have said Jackie would have been hit by a shot from the knoll. I'm convinced all the shots came from from Ozwald. I have had my doubts in the past but not anymore.
 

CowboyDan

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Yeagermeister;3889204 said:
I have never seen the Zapruder film and not sure I want to but the footage shown in the various video shows IMO and as many of you have said Jackie would have been hit by a shot from the knoll. I'm convinced all the shots came from from Ozwald. I have had my doubts in the past but not anymore.

You have a right to believe whatever you choose to believe, but just know that in that video they're disproving the Badgeman photo/film. They're using his supposed location. They're not actually lining up the possible shooter's location consitant with the entry/exit wounds, as they do when they do their 6th floor test.
 

Yeagermeister

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CowboyDan;3889208 said:
You have a right to believe whatever you choose to believe, but just know that in that video they're disproving the Badgeman photo/film. They're using his supposed location. They're not actually lining up the possible shooter's location consitant with the entry/exit wounds, as they do when they do their 6th floor test.

IMO it doesn't matter where they think the person is. JFK was leaning in to Jackie when he is killed. If he was shot from the knoll Jackie would have been killed also.

Again IMO just looking at the actual footage. I respect your opinion but I just don't see it.
 

StanleySpadowski

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I'm thoroughly convinced that Oswald was the sole shooter but part of me believes that Oswald was "influenced" to act and that the so-called "badgeman" was a backup in case Oswald missed.
 

blindzebra

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Dan I love how you keep complaining about entry and exit wounds because on inside the target car they nailed the entry and exit wounds were seen at the autopsy.

And the Parkland doctors said those autopsy photos matched his wounds. The large gapping hole in the back of his head is a creation of the conspiracy nuts.

Further they did scope out other potential sniper spots in Dealey Plaza and found that it would be too open to bystanders or the shot was blocked by the windshield or other passengers.
 
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