Possible QC news

[SALADIN]

Philosophically speaking, sympathy and empathy are the two capabilites that distinguish humans from animals.

Theologically speaking, compassion for those less fortunate, be it thru external or internal weaknesses, is the essence of morality.

Societally speaking, we have come a long way from the time when addiction was viewed as evil. We know it is a sickness.

Hey, on one level I can look at a Quincy Carter and say "you freaking dumbarse, you had it all and threw it all away. I can only wish I had been borne with your talent and good luck."

But on a deeper level, anyone whose inherent flaw causes his own downfall is to be pitied, not censured. The ancient Greeks made a big deal out of the 'nobility' of the fatal, internal flaw, and deemed it "humanity". Aristotle was big on this and if you don't believe me, ask TH..he reads Euripides.

One doesn't have to go that far, but I think the old proverb, "there but for fortune' says it best. And even better the native American "until you've walked
in a man's shoes..."

Most folks realize if they don't have this particular monkey on their back, they are blessed. It isn't a question of absolving the man of his personal responsibility for his actions; it's an understanding that the good Lord chose not to present us with this particular struggle.

Sorry David, but I for one will continue to feel sorrow for the Quincy Carters of this world.

With no apologies.

Well said LaTuna

Outstanding post.

 

[kartr]

Just because he could care less about the activities of a player once they move on, particularly if their actions disrupted the entire team and forced us into going into a season with the likes of Vinny Testeverde at QB?

Quincy Carter cost us victories in 2004 because he was not here. But that is just smashing, I wish him the best?

That is rooting for a player over the franchise and I do not understand that.



You know him personally? If not, then you are assuming.



Devoting three seasons waiting for him to get it together is luke warm? Coach Parcells gave him every chance in the world. Quincy had it all and he chose drugs over his team. Mister Jones and Coach Parcells had a great deal of emotional capital tied up on him and he disappointed them.



20 out of 36 for 210 yards, no touchdowns and 3 interceptions? That is "respectable"?

I start caring for players when they respect the organization and give back as much as they take.

All-time greats like Bob Lilly, Roger Staubach, Emmitt Smith and Troy Aikman are worthy of my admiration. Players who took but did not give anything back are not even worth my time.

Let's see, 20 out 36 for 210 yards against a super bowl caliber defense with no go to receiver or RB, did you compare Brady's numbers for that same game, Carter had a higher completion percentage and threw for 2 yards less than Brady. Brady had all of his starting personnell available, plus his team had a pass rush to throw at Carter. Brady was at home and was in his 3rd year in the same offense. By comparison to what Carter had available, yes, that was respectable.

The Cleveland game: Carter was going against his former head coach who knew all of his weaknesses, Curtis Martin was dinged up and offensive coordinator Paul Hackett didn't game plan for the blitz by his own admission. Contrast what David Carr, a first round qb with Andre Johnson as his go-to guy. The Browns crushed the Texans in their own stadium, but nobody blamed David Carr solely for that debacle, so why blame Carter for everything.

As to Carter's release from Dallas,the NFL didn't suspend Carter, so he was available to play for 16 games last season. He didn't cost the Cowboys any games because he didn't play for them, but he was eligible to play for anybody that wanted him. Carter won 2 games for the Jets which was the difference in them making the playoffs. No one made Dallas throw Carter away. Players who are actually drug suspended still come back to play for their same team. We didn't throw away Leon Lett or Michael Irvin or Eric Wiiliams or Clayton Holmes or Shante Carver when they had drug or alcohol problems. The 'real' reason Carter was released was because Jerry and Bill jumped the gun, thinking they had something special in Henson until he hit the 'rookie wall' half way thru training camp.

As for their support of Carter, allowing him to compete for the starting job was beneficial to the team in '2003 since we made the playoffs and we should have built on that success like the Rams did with Bulger, by rewarding him with an uncontested starting job. The Rams thought about signing Henson, but decided against it for the sake of team chemistry. They wanted to show Bulger that they were 100% behind him. Carter's descent into drugs was directly attributable to Dallas mgmt going back on their word about bringing other qb's to replace him with.(the attempted signing of Kerry Collins, the drafting of Drew Henson and allowing Vinny to compete for a starting job, after saying he was going to be QC's backup). Team chemistry is paramount if you want to succeed and being honest with your players about where they stand contributes favorably to team chemistry. Players have to trust their coaches too and a coach's word must be his bond.

 

[Hostile]

Wanna spice up the offseason??? Start a QC thread... The man just sparks strong feelings in people, for whatever reason.

The QB position does. Opinions are wide and varied on it.

 

[sacase]

What kills me some posters talk about "how he cost us some wins in 04, how he insulted the team" Its a SPORT! This is someone's LIFE. I think that is a bit more important. None of us here is QC friend, we don't KNOW him, he could be a hell of a nice guys who happens to do drugs and is making a mess in his life and for that reason I wish him and every other addict out there the best in getting their lives strait. I guarentee he has cost himself a whole hell of a lot more than he ever cost this team.

I wonder how many posters here smoked a little bud, but are complaining about QC....

 

[LaTunaNostra]

I am really angry with the poster bringing this up.

Why? Where any ex-player ends up is fair game for dog-day discussion.
The problem is no one can bring up the man's name and speculate about his future w/o being accused of being in his '"fan club". I don't think KM did anything worthy of anger for posting the speculation.

I see no one daring call for his return (well, no one but one person lately )

No one defending his drug abuse.

No one claiming JJ and Bill did anything but the right thing in releasing him. If anyone did think, in the midst of the Testaverde experience, that the FO acted too hastily, Q's failing to make that Jets playoff game had to have convinced them. JJ and Bill said "we can't trust him". And they were right.

No one is doing anything here BUT express the desire the guy get his act together. I wish the same thing of freaking Ontarrio Smith.

Quincy Carter is a miserable football player and not much better of a person. There is no reason to care what happens to this guy. He provided nothing to the team except disappointment. He insulted the fans and the organization. He played up some B.S. persecution complex in the media. He blamed everyone and impugned ill motivations instead of admitting that the problem people had with him was his poor play and decision-making ability.

He left here, insulted the organization some more, and then proceeded to do more stupid things personally and play poorly elsewhere.

He is scum. He brought nothing but problems and unneeded drama to the team. I have all the empathy and concern in the world for people who are humble and have problems. But Carter? Forget it. I would be perfectly happy to never hear that stain on our organization's name ever mentioned again.

See, that is the extreme over-reaction that makes you wonder just who it is has not been able to "get over" the Q. Imo, he many merit these aimless discussions, or our sympathy, or our "good riddances", but his ability to inflame the passions of a segment of the fanbase tp this degree is, well, amazing.

Somewhere between the demonization of the player and his sanctification lies the real man. But I 'spose we're all still too close to see it.

And for what it's worth, I am highly suspicious of the motivations of people who still have an interest in this guy. He has done nothing to deserve it.

Well, define "interest". Some of us here have an "interest" in such obscurities as whether Akili Smith gets picked up again, Kyle Turley gains back the weight, Mo Carthon kicks AB's butt, and what Holmy said to Robinson as he escorted him out the door.

Anything, but anything having to do with football, even the banal, no matter how inconsequential is of interest to us. Especially in June and July.

You see, we are ADDICTED.

And Q's just grist for the mill.

 

[LaTunaNostra]

Let's see, 20 out 36 for 210 yards against a super bowl caliber defense with no go to receiver or RB, did you compare Brady's numbers for that same game, Carter had a higher completion percentage and threw for 2 yards less than Brady. Brady had all of his starting personnell available, plus his team had a pass rush to throw at Carter. Brady was at home and was in his 3rd year in the same offense. By comparison to what Carter had available, yes, that was respectable.

The Cleveland game: Carter was going against his former head coach who knew all of his weaknesses, Curtis Martin was dinged up and offensive coordinator Paul Hackett didn't game plan for the blitz by his own admission. Contrast what David Carr, a first round qb with Andre Johnson as his go-to guy. The Browns crushed the Texans in their own stadium, but nobody blamed David Carr solely for that debacle, so why blame Carter for everything.

As to Carter's release from Dallas,the NFL didn't suspend Carter, so he was available to play for 16 games last season. He didn't cost the Cowboys any games because he didn't play for them, but he was eligible to play for anybody that wanted him. Carter won 2 games for the Jets which was the difference in them making the playoffs. No one made Dallas throw Carter away. Players who are actually drug suspended still come back to play for their same team. We didn't throw away Leon Lett or Michael Irvin or Eric Wiiliams or Clayton Holmes or Shante Carver when they had drug or alcohol problems. The 'real' reason Carter was released was because Jerry and Bill jumped the gun, thinking they had something special in Henson until he hit the 'rookie wall' half way thru training camp.

As for their support of Carter, allowing him to compete for the starting job was beneficial to the team in '2003 since we made the playoffs and we should have built on that success like the Rams did with Bulger, by rewarding him with an uncontested starting job. The Rams thought about signing Henson, but decided against it for the sake of team chemistry. They wanted to show Bulger that they were 100% behind him. Carter's descent into drugs was directly attributable to Dallas mgmt going back on their word about bringing other qb's to replace him with.(the attempted signing of Kerry Collins, the drafting of Drew Henson and allowing Vinny to compete for a starting job, after saying he was going to be QC's backup). Team chemistry is paramount if you want to succeed and being honest with your players about where they stand contributes favorably to team chemistry. Players have to trust their coaches too and a coach's word must be his bond.

Bawaaahhahaaa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Here's the other side of the mania....rofl!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[kartr]

hey look, Quincy's mom is back...lets look at your ridiculous post a little at a time:

>>>and a talented young QB who just needs a situation in which he has the full support of his management<<<

he already had that and he blew it...he was the owners hand picked starter at QB...as for the talent thing, he hasnt displayed very much of that so far...

>>> actually think it's a positive that he was in drug rehab because it shows that he is trying to overcome his problem instead of denying that it exists<<<

hey great, he knows a problem exists!!

>>>I also believe that Carthon knows that Carter can actually play in this league and knows how to use him. Plus Crennel has reviewed last years Cleveland vs Jets game and knows that Carter beat his team despite a fine defensive performance and Crennel has game planned for Carter in the 2003 Dallas vs Pats game and knows that QC put up respectable numbers against their super bowl caliber defense with inexperienced receivers and THAM<<<

***? QC managed to generate just 10 pts and 116 passing yards against one of the worst defenses in the league (Cleveland)...against NE the previous yr Carter worked his magic to the tune of ZERO pts and 3 picks and a 38.0 game QB rating...

word of advice man, lay down the crack pipe while you still may have a few brain cells

David

Your obvious dislike of Carter has warped your sense of reality. Cleveland's defense completely shut down the up and coming David Carr last year. The Pats have embarrassed great nfl qb's with great supporting casts,i.e. Peyton Manning. The Pats also forced McNabb into throwing 3 ints and he had Brian Westbrook instead of THam and he had TO instead of the then 2nd year year receiver AB and rookie TE Jason Witten. Carter's 4th year QB raing of 98 and completion percentage of 60.3 showed conclusively what he could do with more time and a better supporting cast around him. No doubt with the supporting the cast in Dallas now, Carter would put up much better numbers. Case in point, Matt Hassellbeck played almost the exact same schedule in 2004 that Carter had in 2003, but Hassellbeck had Shaun Alexander and D. Jackson and K. Robinson and still struggled after playing in the same offense for 3 years. Carter's struggles in 2003 were more the result of his relative inexperience (just 15 starts prior to 2003), schedule( played against 8 of the top ten teams in total defense) and supporting cast, none of which are highly regarded(Terry Glenn,Joey Galloway,Antonio Bryant and THAM). His performance against Baltimore last year who soundly beat Dallas shows what he could do with a real team around him.

 

[jobberone]

hey look, Quincy's mom is back...lets look at your ridiculous post a little at a time:

>>>and a talented young QB who just needs a situation in which he has the full support of his management<<<

he already had that and he blew it...he was the owners hand picked starter at QB...as for the talent thing, he hasnt displayed very much of that so far...

>>> actually think it's a positive that he was in drug rehab because it shows that he is trying to overcome his problem instead of denying that it exists<<<

hey great, he knows a problem exists!!

>>>I also believe that Carthon knows that Carter can actually play in this league and knows how to use him. Plus Crennel has reviewed last years Cleveland vs Jets game and knows that Carter beat his team despite a fine defensive performance and Crennel has game planned for Carter in the 2003 Dallas vs Pats game and knows that QC put up respectable numbers against their super bowl caliber defense with inexperienced receivers and THAM<<<

***? QC managed to generate just 10 pts and 116 passing yards against one of the worst defenses in the league (Cleveland)...against NE the previous yr Carter worked his magic to the tune of ZERO pts and 3 picks and a 38.0 game QB rating...

word of advice man, lay down the crack pipe while you still may have a few brain cells

David

You judge people based on how it affects a football game or how it affects the team you are a fan of? And I doubt you truly know that Quncy does do cocaine. If he does I would suggest you email him directly with the same context and content as the above if you truly have his best interests at heart.

I would suggest that if you insist on judging someone you choose higher ideals than football games. I would suggest you not judge at all but make appraisals to make your choices in life.

What QC does or does not do really doesn't affect your life. If you were to make a judgmental decision to avoid QC as a friend then I would not see that as an unhealthy choice on your part. On the other hand perhaps Quincy needs as many friends as he can get if he's in trouble.

Do you think it is a healthy choice to bash someone you really don't know based on what appears to be a true illness? Would you judge me harshly if I told you I was pancreatically challenged and unable to cope with even moderate glucose loads. Or that I not infrequently was able to stay coherent due to very low glucose loads and needed help from my friends and at times even strangers. If Quincy is an addict then he has an illness. I agree it is self defeating for Quincy to do drugs especially illegal ones but I do understand his problem with dealing with those things. I hope you understand his brain is hard wired differently than yours and that is not a choice for him. It is a choice for him to treat his illness appropriately but I see no heathly motive for any forum member to so harshly criticize him.

Or that I was unable to process information unless it was properly formatted for me to see?

Someone said for with what judgment you judge, you will be judged, and with what measure you measure, it will be measured to you.

Not my wisdom but something for you to consider from someone far wiser and more temperate than I. Your harsh judgment of others is often reflected on this board. Your motives appear fairly transparent but I could be wrong.

If you cannot understand empathy, sympathy, compassion and reflect on what is truly important in life then I pity you as much as I do Quincy. Notice I said pity and not judge as that is not my task, desire, duty or reason to be.

This is not a flame and I consider myself to have at least as many faults as Quincy or any other member of this board and likely more.

It's merely something for you to reflect on based on your on comments here and previously as I remember them.

The same speech applies to you Alexander. I do grow annoyed by yours and others constant negativity towards others with motives that are self serving.

Since I'm not a moderator I feel free to say these things in the hopes the board will grow. However, I have no expectations.

You're both welcome to your opinions of me. I can take it.

 

[WoodysGirl]

The QB position does. Opinions are wide and varied on it.

You not kidding, Hos. This thread started out as simple FYI and has turned it into something that's outside the realm of football completely. It's hilarious to read some of the long-winded dissertations being posted about our former QB...pro, con, neutral, extreme hatred, and whatever.

It's funny, cuz the same thing can be said about our new QB Bledsoe. Wanna start an interesting thread, post some obscure stat about Bledsoe and you're almost guaranteed a 600 post thread...

 

[Alexander]

Carter had a higher completion percentage and threw for 2 yards less than Brady.

Oh brother.

Next you will say that if you put Carter on the Patriots he has three rings.

Go ahead. Say it.

I dare you.

Brady had all of his starting personnell available, plus his team had a pass rush to throw at Carter. Brady was at home and was in his 3rd year in the same offense. By comparison to what Carter had available, yes, that was respectable.

The Cleveland game: Carter was going against his former head coach who knew all of his weaknesses, Curtis Martin was dinged up and offensive coordinator Paul Hackett didn't game plan for the blitz by his own admission. Contrast what David Carr, a first round qb with Andre Johnson as his go-to guy. The Browns crushed the Texans in their own stadium, but nobody blamed David Carr solely for that debacle, so why blame Carter for everything.

What does what Carter did with the Jets have to do with anything? You made a sad comment about a poor performance against the Patriots where he was intercepted three times. Excuse, excuse, excuse. You even extend it to the Jets. I wonder if you took a vested interest in the Jets only when he started playing for them. I bet you did.

As to Carter's release from Dallas,the NFL didn't suspend Carter, so he was available to play for 16 games last season.

Maybe he just did not get caught with his Whizzinator. Who knows?

He didn't cost the Cowboys any games because he didn't play for them, but he was eligible to play for anybody that wanted him. Carter won 2 games for the Jets which was the difference in them making the playoffs.

Earlier you excused his performances for a lack of a supporting cast, poor coaching and intergalactic cosmic rays. Now here you have him winning games by himself and because of him the Jets made the playoffs. And I guess you do not see anything wrong with that logic?

No one made Dallas throw Carter away. Players who are actually drug suspended still come back to play for their same team. We didn't throw away Leon Lett or Michael Irvin or Eric Wiiliams or Clayton Holmes or Shante Carver when they had drug or alcohol problems.

I wonder why we were so hellbent on punishing ourselves by cutting him? We never did it before--interesting.

The answer is that was a different regime. Coach Parcells does not tolerate character risks if he cannot trust their judgement on the field. Bad character + good football judgement gets more leeway.

The 'real' reason Carter was released was because Jerry and Bill jumped the gun, thinking they had something special in Henson until he hit the 'rookie wall' half way thru training camp.

Or maybe they just tired of his lies and deceit and could not trust him? You do not know the whole story. I don't and do not assign reasons to why he was released.

I just know he was. Because if he wasn't, we could have had our starting QB and would not have had to go through Testeverde last year.

As for their support of Carter, allowing him to compete for the starting job was beneficial to the team in '2003 since we made the playoffs and we should have built on that success like the Rams did with Bulger, by rewarding him with an uncontested starting job. The Rams thought about signing Henson, but decided against it for the sake of team chemistry. They wanted to show Bulger that they were 100% behind him. Carter's descent into drugs was directly attributable to Dallas mgmt going back on their word about bringing other qb's to replace him with.(the attempted signing of Kerry Collins, the drafting of Drew Henson and allowing Vinny to compete for a starting job, after saying he was going to be QC's backup). Team chemistry is paramount if you want to succeed and being honest with your players about where they stand contributes favorably to team chemistry. Players have to trust their coaches too and a coach's word must be his bond.

Where are you getting this nonsense from? Are you deranged or something?

This is a joke, right?

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Personally I see celebs and athletes as people who get paid to entertain me and who happen to make alot of money doing so. I could care less what they do at home. I dont' want to be like many of them.

I do understand what you are saying also, but let me point out that if your employer gives you a drug test all they can do is fire you. They can't press charges against you and niether can the police. I don't think professional athletes should be above the law, in fact the law applies to them like it does to everyone else, which is why I think the law passed by congress concerning professional sports and drugs will eventually be ruled unconstitutional. Which athletes have been caught and have gotten a free pass? I am not trying to be funny but honestly I really don't follow alot of these guys legal issues outside of football, other than the big cases like Ray Lewis, Ray Carruth, Etc.

Professional athlets do have rules of conduct in the contracts, however if they wanted to hang out in strib clubs and such in their free time, then there is very little that can be done, especially if they do exactly what they have to do when they are playing their sport. But with that said they might not get those big endorsment deals, due to a morality clause. Nothing in their contract says they have to be a role models. We choose to make them such and apply our own morals on them.

With QC, I feel sorry for the guy, I hate to see drugs ruin anyone's life QC's or anyone else's for that matter. However if you do make a mistake and hurt someone else then you should pay the price. Honestly how many People can claim they took their team to the playoffs? Not saying he was the best thing since sliced bread but he did have an accomplishment that 99.9% of us will never have. QC is good enough to play somewhere and if he can get a hold of his drug problem then he has a reasonable chance to succeed.

Celebs and athletes are role models. It's a like it or not kind of thing. In the case of Pro Sports, it's a matter of entertainment value. The league is only as strong as it's image to the customer. That's why all of these athletes not only need to realize that they are role models but need to embrase the fact. There is a limit to the publics willingness to accept certain behaviors. For the good of the league, this is something that I believe modern players need to understand and embrase.

As for the Pro Athletes getting away with things that your normal employee wouldn't, it is another one of those like it or not things. If you were caught with drugs on the premisuse or you employer, you would get fired and your employer would have the option to call the police. Not so in the NFL. You automatically get rehab options and all that goes along with it. Much of this comes down to money and if an individual has enough of it. If you do, then many things can be avoided in the courts. Sad but true, so I don't really point out athletes and say it's all on them but it is what it is. They have money and with that, much can be accomplished. In the final analysis, I think we can all agree that Pro Athletes, for a merriod (that a word?) of reasons, get certain bennies that your average citizen wouldn't.

If I'm not mistaken, there are two contracts NFL players sign. One is directly with the club he plays for and the other is with the league. Being elligable to play in the National Football League is not a right. In fact, it is an acceptance. There is a personal conduct code each player agrees to. It's interesting how this works. There is a fine line between talent and the actual product. The product is entertainment. When that audience is impacted, the talent doesn't matter. I actually believe the new legislations will stick. Pro Athletes don't have the same rights your average employee does. Because of the Leagues unique status, the same rules don't apply. I think the public is tired of seeing athletes behaive the way they do. I think Government is also tired of it. Something has to give. I don't think it will be the consumers or the US Government but that's just an opinion of mine.

As far as QC is concerned, I wish him well in his personal life but I think he's done. I have personal views of his situation and his time here with the Cowboys but what good would voicing them do now? His time is done. I'm on with the business of the here and now. I wish him well and hope he gets his stuff together, just not here in Dallas.

 

[LaTunaNostra]

and supporting cast, none of which are highly regarded(Terry Glenn,Joey Galloway,Antonio Bryant and THAM).

What about Terry Glenn!!??

Q was lucky to have him -forced to play possession receiver and go over the middle for the those passes Q hung him out to dry for. I'm just thankful Q's inaccuracy didn't end Terry's career.

Let's also forget all the extra curricula help both T and Richie Anderson put in mentoring the ingrate. Everytime I saw T go back to the huddle and tell oblivious Quincy what he had seen, it made me proud..but in the end YOUR BOY let MY BOY down.

His performance against Baltimore last year who soundly beat Dallas shows what he could do with a real team around him.

What? The Jets LOST that game, 17-20. Q put up less than 200...too little, too late. And if he cared so much for the "real team" around him, pehaps he wouldn't have been a no-show in Pittsburgh.

Your boy screwed BOTH my teams.

It's only with the maximum of effort I can eke out what 's left of my concept of 'charity'.

Gotta love it!!

 

[trickblue]

Anyone have any thoughts on Hutch?

 

[Alexander]

Anyone have any thoughts on Hutch?

LOL!!!

 

[StanleySpadowski]

Wanna spice up the offseason??? Start a QC thread... The man just sparks strong feelings in people, for whatever reason.

The reason is pretty simple. A lot of people chose sides in the Hutchinson/Carter debates and put their "football knowledge" credibility on the line in doing so. When Carter started, the pro-Carter crowd had the upper hand, but when he failed, so did their own sense of superiority.

The only way to regain that feeling of "manhood" (in most cases) is for Carter to perform at a pro bowl level somewhere.

This has less to do with Quincy Carter the player or the person and more to do with our own pecadillos and inadequacies.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Anyone have any thoughts on Hutch?

No, he had no drug problems. There fore, he's not elligable for any sympathy or well wishes on this here board.

LOL

 

[Alexander]

And if he cared so much for the "real team" around him, pehaps he wouldn't have been a no-show in Pittsburgh.

:clap2: :clap2:

 

[LaTunaNostra]

.

The only way to regain that feeling of "manhood" (in most cases) is for Carter to perform at a pro bowl level somewhere.

Agreed!

I just won't feel like a man again til Q's back on a payroll.

 

[WoodysGirl]

Anyone have any thoughts on Hutch?

He can't sing very well. Or was he the one playing the guitar? I forget.

Whichever it was, he sucked and I can't believe he embarassed the star by going on national TV and playing/singing that way!!!!!




So was that strong enuff? I really wanted to express my disappointment in Chutch's ability as an artist...

 

[Alexander]

He can't sing very well. Or was he the one playing the guitar? I forget.

Whichever it was, he sucked and I can't believe he embarassed the star by going on national TV and playing/singing that way!!!!!




So was that strong enuff? I really wanted to express my disappointment in Chutch's ability as an artist...

WG, can you be a doll and post some Chad Hutchinson updates too?