Revisiting Romo's Late Game Stats

[percyhoward]

So when I make the point the quarterback loses a game by a late interception, then the people come out of the wood work and tell me "no this is a team sport."

But no matter what you say, Percy, Romo doers not complete a pass without a receiver. In your stats you don't see the under throws, overthrows, behind the receiver p[***** that the receive3r makes a grea5t play to make that completetion Romo gets credit for.

The kinds of plays you describe happen with all quarterbacks on all teams, and they go the other way just as often too. As for your other point, that depends on the game doesn't it? I wouldn't blame Romo for the Denver loss last year, and I wouldn't give him credit for the win in Buffalo in '07 when he threw 5 interceptions either.

Apply common sense, in other words.

 

[KJJ]

Not really. You write a paragraph about Romo's turnovers and overall poor play, and sprinkle in a sentence about the defense. That's not a majority.

You're just one of those who's trying to stir things up. The Cowboys poor defensive play has been mentioned several times by me but you obviously want to create a problem. If that's your intension move on.

 

[WPBCowboysFan]

Apply common sense, in other words.

Thats really asking for a lot around here.

 

[WPBCowboysFan]

You're just one of those who's trying to stir things up. The Cowboys poor defensive play has been mentioned several times by me but you obviously want to create a problem. If that's your intension move on.

Ha Ha, a lil butt hurt are we? Got called on your BS and now you're butt hurt.

 

[Picksix]

You're just one of those who's trying to stir things up. The Cowboys poor defensive play has been mentioned several times by me but you obviously want to create a problem. If that's your intension move on.

No, I'm offering a legitimate rebuttal to a view point with which I disagree. Seriously? You're accusing someone else of trying to stir things up and cause trouble?

 

[WPBCowboysFan]

No, I'm offering a legitimate rebuttal to a view point with which I disagree. Seriously? You're accusing someone else of trying to stir things up and cause trouble?

The irony, huh?

 

[KJJ]

No, I'm offering a legitimate rebuttal to a view point with which I disagree. Seriously? You're accusing someone else of trying to stir things up and cause trouble?

You have no idea what my viewpoint is because you're claiming I'm putting most of the blame on Romo which is completely untrue. You're just reading what you want into my comments. I have a post in this thread stating the elimination game losses have been a collective effort by the "team." Did you miss that one? Everytime I comment about Romo it gets spun into something it's not by the agenda crowd. You didn't answer my question does Romo deserve none of the blame for the teams 6 elimination games losses?

 

[DFWJC]

The former New York Giants quarterback is just fine with the Dallas Cowboys giving Romo a six-year, $108 million extension. Simms, who won two Super Bowls during his 14-year career, says that the stat of Romo being 1-6 in win-or-go-home games is overemphasized to make Romo appear worse than he really is.

Like many experts have said over the last few months, Simms, an NFL broadcaster for CBS, says Romo is the main reason the Cowboys even had a chance at reaching the postseason in 2012.

“I think it was a good signing by the Cowboys,” Simms said. “If they wouldn’t have signed him and he became a free agent, everybody says, ‘Oh, just let him go.’ My God, there would’ve been teams doing cartwheels trying to get him. I think everybody in the league realizes the talent. I read some things that people said about Tony Romo.

“The Dallas Cowboys were probably a 4-12, 6-10 team last year and he was at least fighting to get them into the playoffs to the last game of the year. Now, we’ve all of a sudden created a new stat for Tony Romo, elimination games. We don’t say it about any other quarterback, but elimination games for Tony Romo because it sounds a lot better. ‘We can get more losses on that column.’
-----
Sports Illustrated issue, announcer Phil Simms let loose with a valiant defense of Tony Romo.

You can't deny what you see on the football field all the time: his outstanding play and really, his ability. We talked to Tony Romo about why so many people are on him and why he's constantly criticized, and he goes: "Look, I understand it. Until I win the Super Bowl, I'm always going to have those questions and criticisms."

But you know, Jim, to make the story bigger, we embellish too much. The media - and we're part of it - everybody's playoff record comes out there. Well, Tony Romo has a new category I've never heard [applied to] any other quarterback but him: Elimination games. Because they want to make it more, make it look worse.

Elimination games? What are those?! Let's make up a new stat so you can make it look worse!

----------
um, i'd hardly call simms a FAN. maybe there's a reason people don't talk about it and maybe it's because it's not applied to any other qb, just by romo bashers.

Simms nailed it

Aikman, Warner, Staubach, and the vast majority of people who actually know something about playing the position would agree.

 

[percyhoward]

Missing Dez on that throw didn't have any negative affect on Romo's completion percentage or passer rating because he hit on over 78% of his throws. His 2 turnovers didn't have any negative affect on his 106 passer rating because of his high completion percentage and tossing 2 TD's. A QB can make several big mistakes and still maintain a high passer rating.

Romo missed a throw to Austin a few weeks earlier that would have sealed the game vs the Giants. That misfire didn't have any affect on his 141.3 passer rating which was much higher than Eli's 90.7 passer rating. Just more proof it's not about passer ratings it's about avoiding bad plays in critical situations and making big plays.

This is completely wrong, because either of the plays you mentioned would have raised comp %, lowered int %, and raised yards per attempt, all of which would have raised pass rating. This isn't even debatable.

 

[DFWJC]

The kinds of plays you describe happen with all quarterbacks on all teams, and they go the other way just as often too. As for your other point, that depends on the game doesn't it? I wouldn't blame Romo for the Denver loss last year, and I wouldn't give him credit for the win in Buffalo in '07 when he threw 5 interceptions either.

Apply common sense, in other words.

Really good examples...both ways

 

[Little Jr]

Wins and losses *are* what matter. When you're evaluating a TEAM. Or a coaching staff. Or a GM.

Ill remember this quote

 

[KJJ]

This is completely wrong, because either of the plays you mentioned would have raised comp %, lowered int %, and raised yards per attempt, all of which would have raised pass rating. This isn't even debatable.

LOL I'm aware either play would have raised or lowered his completion % and affected his passer rating but not significantly. Regardless of the two missed throws he had an excellent completion % and passer rating in both games and still lost. One play can be the difference between winning and losing despite a QB's passer rating. Romo had a much higher passer rating than Mark Sanchez on opening day 2011 but the Cowboys still lost.

 

[percyhoward]

LOL I'm aware either play would have raised or lowered his completion % and affected his passer rating but not significantly.

The whole point is that if the effect isn't significant, then neither is the pass play. The bigger the pass play, the greater the effect on the rating that measures it. And yes it is possible for the QB with the higher rating to lose a game here or there. But that will never happen with any consistency without major changes to the game. Look at the entire history of the NFL and try to find one great QB with a rating lower than the average of his era.

 

[jnday]

Show me where I said romo is blameless. I'll wait, I got plenty of time

In your last post responding to me , you said that I was only wanting to blame Romo without seeing the entire picture. Who else do you think should be blamed for the turnovers ? You can blame Garrett for many things, but he is not the one that is making the bad throws. Jerry should be blamed for his screw-ups, but again, he is not the one throwing the ball. I can name every coach and player that is associated with the Cowboys, but none of them are throwing the interceptions. What more of the entire picture do I need to see? There has been numerous times where Romo has simply made bad throws that resulted in interceptions and it cost the Cowboys the win or the chance for a win. It has happened and I don't think that you can deny it. _What am I missing here?

 

[percyhoward]

One play can be the difference between winning and losing despite a QB's passer rating.

You're so good at putting your thoughts into words that when you're wrong, it's easy to see where your thinking went wrong. Buffalo '07, the Dallas defense was so good that all of the bad plays by Romo that should have made a difference, didn't.

For most of his career, the opposite has been true. All the good plays that should make a difference, don't. There's a reason his rating in losses is higher than anybody else's, and it ain't because pass rating is a bad stat.

 

[KJJ]

The whole point is that if the effect isn't significant, then neither is the pass play. The bigger the pass play, the greater the effect on the rating that measures it. And yes it is possible for the QB with the higher rating to lose a game here or there. But that will never happen with any consistency without major changes to the game. Look at the entire history of the NFL and try to find one great QB with a rating lower than the average of his era.

The point I'm making is his passer rating in both games vs the Giants in 2011 were significant without completing those 2 passes. Sure a TD on both plays would have raised his passer rating considerably but even though they fell incomplete his passer ratings in both games still indicated virtually flawless performances. A QB's passer rating may correlate into winning on some teams but not with the Cowboys because the team is poorly coached and has a terrible defense. Romo has lost a number of high passer rating games due to poor defensive play and coaching mistakes. He had a very good game vs AZ in 2011 (95.2 passer rating with no turnovers) but Garrett botched that game from the sidelines in the final seconds of regulation by icing his own kicker who just put what would have been the game winner through the uprights.

The Cowboys are dependent on Romo playing great or they have no chance. Denver was pretty much like that last season with Manning if he was off the Broncos were done. Every game Manning had a turnover in the Broncos lost. If you don't have a defense it puts it all on the QB. Romo lost 4 games last season in which he had passer ratings of over 100.0. His passer ratings don't correlate into winning with the team he has. He has to play mistake free football to have any chance of winning with a historically bad defense.

 

[iceberg]

In your last post responding to me , you said that I was only wanting to blame Romo without seeing the entire picture. Who else do you think should be blamed for the turnovers ? You can blame Garrett for many things, but he is not the one that is making the bad throws. Jerry should be blamed for his screw-ups, but again, he is not the one throwing the ball. I can name every coach and player that is associated with the Cowboys, but none of them are throwing the interceptions. What more of the entire picture do I need to see? There has been numerous times where Romo has simply made bad throws that resulted in interceptions and it cost the Cowboys the win or the chance for a win. It has happened and I don't think that you can deny it. _What am I missing here?

Common sense

 

[KJJ]

You're so good at putting your thoughts into words that when you're wrong, it's easy to see where your thinking went wrong. Buffalo '07, the Dallas defense was so good that all of the bad plays by Romo that should have made a difference, didn't.

For most of his career, the opposite has been true. All the good plays that should make a difference, don't. There's a reason his rating in losses is higher than anybody else's, and it ain't because pass rating is a bad stat.

Romo was terrible for 56 minutes in that game but played flawless the final 4 minutes putting the Cowboys in position to kick the game winner. It was one of the worst and best performances of his career. He did everything well in those final minutes from managing the clock to avoiding mistakes. Buffalo had a team in 07 similar to the team the Cowboys have now of finding ways to lose games. If Romo played late in games the way he did vs Buffalo in 07 he wouldn't carry the stigma he does now.

Montana didn't play very well vs the Cowboys in the 81 title game Danny White outplayed him but he was brilliant in the final 3 minutes with the game on the line. It's not how you start games it's how you finish them that's what leaves a lasting memory. Romo was fantastic for 58 minutes vs Denver last season but all anyone remembers is the one bad throw he made all day because it occurred with the game on the line.

 

[percyhoward]

The Cowboys are dependent on Romo playing great or they have no chance. Romo lost 4 games last season in which he had passer ratings of over 100.0. His passer ratings don't correlate into winning with the team he has.

Pass rating differential (offense's rating minus defense's) is what put this team at 8-8. Dallas is just another example of this stat's relevance.

 

[jnday]

Common sense

Ice, there is just no helping you. I used common sense when I explained my position. If you are honest, you can't deny that Romo has cost the team wins with his turnovers.