Sean Payton > Bill Parcells

[cowboyed]

Lets not make him King of the NFL yet, he has just one playoff game so far.

Yeah, let's talk Parcellian and not get that annointing oil out just quite yet.

Excuse me but Payton has been proving it all season long. His offense more often than not keeps the opponents D on its heels. I believe it in the top 3 of the entire NFL. The Saints D is not comprised of superstars and has given up big plays but not at our overrated defensive levels. Their defensive front is definitely more effective than ours.

Payton has done a superlative job acquiring players in free agency and the draft. And then the way he has used players on the offense is outstanding. Payton has also made 100s of offensive playcalling decisions and has acquired coaches that would work well with him and within the system.

 

[burmafrd]

ONE SEASON gomers. They were saying that about Gruden after one season in TB. Guess what they are saying now.
The Saints had a lot of talent; Payton had a lot more talent then BP did coming in here. Haslet was just a bad coach in that he knew nothing about discipline, in addition to other failings. The TALENT was there for a good solid team. Adding Brees, Bush and the others put them over the top. Brees is having a CAREER YEAR. How often does that happen? I think he has them over acheiving right now- but that is fine and should not be considered criticism. I think they will come down to earth if they make it to the SB; but that really does not matter. This is already very close to the best season the Saints have ever had (not record wise, but in other ways). Payton deserves full props, but to make any statements about how good a HC he is after one year just totally discredits anyone trying to do so.

 

[Skin]

..........ya, and who is in charge of obtaining the talent at these positions the last 4 years?

Payton's greatness or lack thereof will be determined over time, but there is no doubt in my mind that right now I'd rather have him as coach of the Cowboys that Bill Parcells. The Tuna is washed up. And, for all of you who keep talking about our lack of talent, HELLO, Purcells is buying the groceries here.

 

[burmafrd]

We shall see. BP will be under the microscope next season for sure. But annointing ANY coach after just ONE YEAR is just plain STUPID.
Like so many were annointing Romo after 5 games.

 

[Mr Cowboy]

Payton's greatness or lack thereof will be determined over time, but there is no doubt in my mind that right now I'd rather have him as coach of the Cowboys that Bill Parcells. The Tuna is washed up. And, for all of you who keep talking about our lack of talent, HELLO, Purcells is buying the groceries here.

This it absolutely correct!

typical, shortsighted observation.

if the aints had fumbles like we had by WITTEN, TERRY, ROMO and big drops from butterfingers TO, Sean would be sporting puffy, red eyes and a loss tonight.

If Parcells had the defense playing well and not allowed it to collapse in December, we would not have been playing in Seattle last week. We would have been playing last night or today.

Utlimately the demise of this team is all on Parcells. He can't adjust to a changing NFL and he is the gorcery shopper as well. He has bought the groceries for 4 years and has so far come up with stale vegatables, not enough beef and too much rotten fruit.

 

[cml750]

I just can not understand all of the blind faith in BP. He has been in charge for 4 years, doing all of "the grocery shopping", yet we are a completely mediocore team . Payton has done a masterful job of turning the Saints around in 1 season. Payton plays to win! He designs a game plan to take it to the the other team every week while BP likes to play it safe while trying not to lose. We already let Payton slip through our fingers but I pray JJ comes to his senses and sends Tuna riding into the sunset. We need a coach with a lot of emotion, like Payton, to light a fire under this team before we will ever have a chance of having any real success. :bang2:

 

[Doomsday]

And it's also the type of playcalling that got the Saints to the NFC championship while Parcells sits and thinks about what could of been....

I guess it was the playcalling that was suppose to block for Romo. If they had called the right plays Romo would of hit time to set up and find a WR. I get it now. Its not the players fault that got whipped at the LOS and couldnt even block Seattle when they rushed 4.

 

[Doomsday]

..........ya, and who is in charge of obtaining the talent at these positions the last 4 years?

Last time I checked Jerry was the GM.

 

[Sarge]

Last time I checked Jerry was the GM.

Last time I checked he was too. Your point?

 

[percyhoward]

I liked Payton as a play-caller when he was here, but I question how big a part he has really played in the Saints' turnaround from 3-13 to the NFCC. He deserves his due credit, as does the whole team, but he isn't the savior of the franchise.

Haslett always had the Saints around .500 with Brooks at QB (records of 8-8, 8-8, 9-7, 7-9, and 10-6 going back over his years prior to last year) then comes Katrina. The team is living out of a suitcase for an entire season, their best player, McAllister misses eleven games, and this .500 team drops to an extremely misleading 3-13. What should be the expectations in that situation?

Exit Haslett and Brooks, enter Payton along with a very fortunate series of events. Miami says no to a Pro Bowl QB, Houston says no to a Heisman RB, and both players fall into Payton's lap. 16 regular season games and 2,212 YAC yards later, Payton is Coach of the Year.

NO got over 1,000 YAC yards from their backs alone. That's a big pad to Drew Brees' passer rating, and also to the Saints' total offense stats, making Payton look like an offensive genius.

Counting returns, rush yards, and YAC, Bush gained 1,502 yards running with the ball this year. Any bets he won't crack 2,000 next year?

Looking at the weapons NO has on offense, and how guys like Bradie James got worse since last year, I'd say our real loss wasn't Payton, but Gibbs.

There's a guy who should be coordinator of the year, if there is such an award.

 

[dbair1967]

Last time I checked Jerry was the GM.

he's a GM in title only people

the person calling all the shots is your beloved Parcells...I dont know why thats so hard for people to get...other than cleaning the head, setting ticket and concession prices and emptying the garbage cans, there isnt anything associated with this team that Parcells doesnt control

David

 

[Doomsday]

I liked Payton as a play-caller when he was here, but I question how big a part he has really played in the Saints' turnaround from 3-13 to the NFCC. He deserves his due credit, as does the whole team, but he isn't the savior of the franchise.

Haslett always had the Saints around .500 with Brooks at QB (records of 8-8, 8-8, 9-7, 7-9, and 10-6 going back over his years prior to last year) then comes Katrina. The team is living out of a suitcase for an entire season, their best player, McAllister misses eleven games, and this .500 team drops to an extremely misleading 3-13. What should be the expectations in that situation?

Exit Haslett and Brooks, enter Payton along with a very fortunate series of events. Miami says no to a Pro Bowl QB, Houston says no to a Heisman RB, and both players fall into Payton's lap. 16 regular season games and 2,212 YAC yards later, Payton is Coach of the Year.

NO got over 1,000 YAC yards from their backs alone. That's a big pad to Drew Brees' passer rating, and also to the Saints' total offense stats, making Payton look like an offensive genius.

Counting returns, rush yards, and YAC, Bush gained 1,502 yards running with the ball this year. Any bets he won't crack 2,000 next year?

Looking at the weapons NO has on offense, and how guys like Bradie James got worse since last year, I'd say our real loss wasn't Payton, but Gibbs.

There's a guy who should be coordinator of the year, if there is such an award.

Excellent post!

 

[Doomsday]

he's a GM in title only people

the person calling all the shots is your beloved Parcells...I dont know why thats so hard for people to get...other than cleaning the head, setting ticket and concession prices and emptying the garbage cans, there isnt anything associated with this team that Parcells doesnt control

David

Unless were talking about TO than it was all Jerry. Which is it? Yes BP is calling most of the shots but dont think for a second that Jerry doesnt have his hand in everything.

 

[SkinsandTerps]

YAC as in Carry or Catch ?

 

[dbair1967]

Unless were talking about TO than it was all Jerry. Which is it? Yes BP is calling most of the shots but dont think for a second that Jerry doesnt have his hand in everything.

Jerry and Stephen both said Parcells had multiple opportunities to nix the TO deal...if Parcells didnt want him here, he wouldnt be here

David

 

[percyhoward]

YAC as in Carry or Catch ?

...catch.

 

[AbeBeta]

Are people serious here that SP is > BP? Maybe, just maybe we could give him another season or two to show his stuff.

SP came into a great situation this year -- he came to a decent team -- a team that had come off an awful season but was far far better than their record. So he gets a middle of the pack team -- plus he's got the #2 overall pick which drops the best offensive player in his lap b/c the Texans are idiotic. Then he gets perhaps the best FA QB to be available in the past decade. Plus, every road game they play, they've got half the fans in their corner.

He's certainly done a great job and many more experienced coaches would have been poor choices here.

 

[dbair1967]

Are people serious here that SP is > BP? Maybe, just maybe we could give him another season or two to show his stuff.

SP came into a great situation this year -- he came to a decent team -- a team that had come off an awful season but was far far better than their record. So he gets a middle of the pack team -- plus he's got the #2 overall pick which drops the best offensive player in his lap b/c the Texans are idiotic. Then he gets perhaps the best FA QB to be available in the past decade. Plus, every road game they play, they've got half the fans in their corner.

He's certainly done a great job and many more experienced coaches would have been poor choices here.

please, that was an atrocious team last yr...they arnt a loaded team...he coached alot of guys up and made this team eons better...their OL and defense were absolute train wrecks

David

 

[SkinsandTerps]

...catch.

Actually, I meant contact or catch.

Not carry. :bang2:

 

[Bleu Star]

If Parcells had the defense playing well and not allowed it to collapse in December, we would not have been playing in Seattle last week. We would have been playing last night or today.

Utlimately the demise of this team is all on Parcells. He can't adjust to a changing NFL and he is the gorcery shopper as well. He has bought the groceries for 4 years and has so far come up with stale vegatables, not enough beef and too much rotten fruit.

I just can not understand all of the blind faith in BP. He has been in charge for 4 years, doing all of "the grocery shopping", yet we are a completely mediocore team . Payton has done a masterful job of turning the Saints around in 1 season. Payton plays to win! He designs a game plan to take it to the the other team every week while BP likes to play it safe while trying not to lose. We already let Payton slip through our fingers but I pray JJ comes to his senses and sends Tuna riding into the sunset. We need a coach with a lot of emotion, like Payton, to light a fire under this team before we will ever have a chance of having any real success. :bang2:

he's a GM in title only people

the person calling all the shots is your beloved Parcells...I dont know why thats so hard for people to get...other than cleaning the head, setting ticket and concession prices and emptying the garbage cans, there isnt anything associated with this team that Parcells doesnt control

David

At least some of you see where I was going with this thread. This isn't the first < > thread title I have created and it won't be the last. If you look past the title itself then you'll see what some of the posters clearly see. That is an attempt to stimulate conversation about our beloved Tuna. This is a "what have you done for me lately" league in today's day and age. Parcells has done nothing short of field a mediocre team over his 4 year tenure with players that he selected. So when we sit here and say "it's not all coaches, the players ultimately have to make plays" I will return with "They're his players. He selected them. The mess has his name written all over it. He stamped this team."

Do I really believe Payton > Parcells? As of this moment Payton has proven himself to be far better than Parcells this year. There's no question. Bill Parcells is a hecuva HOF coach but I refuse to live upon and worship his past. We can go back and forth and debate whether or not Drew Brees in better than Tom Brady all day long. Drew Brees has had a stellar year. Stellar! Yet Brady has the hardware in the trophy case and the longevity argument in his corner. Do you see the parallel? You say the Saints are simply riding a wave of emotion. Does this mean Brees is truly overachieving as well? Is he better than Brady and his "resume"? It's the same argument.

I'm into what Bill can and has done for the Boys today. That equates to a whole lot of nothing. Yet still, he's sitting back contemplating a decision on whether or not he's coming back... God that is so lame... it pisses me off to no end. :bang2: