Speculation: FSU and Clemson to big 12?

[JohnnyHopkins]

If I look at the ACC, I really only see VaTech as the loan school with a good football program over the last several years. In 2006, they were 11-3 but they lost to GTech, Georgia and BC. They beat Cincy but they were 8-5 that year and lost to every good team on their schedule.

In 2007, they were 11-3 but again, they lost to LSU, BC and Kansas. They beat Miami and FSU who were both terrible. FSU lost to Kentucky in a Bowl Game that year.

2008, again a good record 10-4 but lost to ECarolina, FSU, BC and Miami. None of those teams were very good but they did have good wins against BC, Cincy and Nebraska. Going to say that even though the record was worse, this was a better VaTech team.

2009- 3 with loses against Bama, GTech and UNC. Beat a 6 loss Tennessee team in the Bowl game, Miami and Nebraska.

2010 11-3. Lost to Boise, James Madison and Stanford in the Bowl. Beat FSU, NCSt. and that's really about it.

2011 11-3. Again, Lost to Clemson twice, lost to Michigan in a Bowl.

They are, IMO, the best football program in the ACC but to be honest, they don't play a tough schedule. 10 of those games are gimmie games every year. It's hard to know how good they really are.

Even Florida State has not been a great team since 2006. They are recruiting much better and I do believe that they are on the rise but honestly, they are between a 6 and 4 loss team consistently since 2006.

I just don't see the ACC as anywhere near the quality of Football Conference as the Big 12 and I think Power Rankins prove that.

Honestly, I would say that it is a regional thing. Most people over in the heart of ACC Country don't think the Big Twelve is anything more than Texas, Oklahoma and their tag alongs. They see a conference was just raided by three others conferences and almost fell entirely apart.

I'm not saying that I feel that way, because I have lived in Texas as well as the East Coast and I know how passionate Okie State, Baylor and Texas Tech fans are. Fine teams in the conference and TCU and West Virginia were solid additions.

All I am doing is pointing out the perspective. I'm sure we will see how FSU feels soon enough.

 

[Aikbach]

First I've heard of this, no knowledge of the matter to speak of or offer I'm afraid.

 

[rkell87]

@kbohls Texas, Texas Tech school officials dismiss rumors of FSU/Clem possible exit to Big 12. "First I've heard of it," one high-up says

 

[rkell87]

Dan Wetzel ‏ @DanWetzel
I can add to one part of @ChipBrownOB story on FSU/Big12. FSU officials have, at least internally, discussed potential for own TV network

 

[DFWJC]

If I look at the ACC, I really only see VaTech as the loan school with a good football program over the last several years. In 2006, they were 11-3 but they lost to GTech, Georgia and BC. They beat Cincy but they were 8-5 that year and lost to every good team on their schedule.

In 2007, they were 11-3 but again, they lost to LSU, BC and Kansas. They beat Miami and FSU who were both terrible. FSU lost to Kentucky in a Bowl Game that year.

2008, again a good record 10-4 but lost to ECarolina, FSU, BC and Miami. None of those teams were very good but they did have good wins against BC, Cincy and Nebraska. Going to say that even though the record was worse, this was a better VaTech team.

2009- 3 with loses against Bama, GTech and UNC. Beat a 6 loss Tennessee team in the Bowl game, Miami and Nebraska.

2010 11-3. Lost to Boise, James Madison and Stanford in the Bowl. Beat FSU, NCSt. and that's really about it.

2011 11-3. Again, Lost to Clemson twice, lost to Michigan in a Bowl.

They are, IMO, the best football program in the ACC but to be honest, they don't play a tough schedule. 10 of those games are gimmie games every year. It's hard to know how good they really are.

Even Florida State has not been a great team since 2006. They are recruiting much better and I do believe that they are on the rise but honestly, they are between a 6 and 4 loss team consistently since 2006.

I just don't see the ACC as anywhere near the quality of Football Conference as the Big 12 and I think Power Rankins prove that.

In the previous post you say the performance is nebulous and that the ACC will always be a hoops conference.

Then you proceed to take a very narrow snapshot of performance and try to make that relevant. Everyone knows the ACC has been down recently. But I don't think anyone feels that that this tiny window of time is a permanant thing.

The data is either important or it isn't...can't have it both ways ABQ.

For example, as you stated, Florida State has not really been all that good since 2006...as if they won't be a super power again real soon.
Well, the last two years they've had crazy good recruiting classes and Jimbo Fisher has them heading toward powerhouse status again.

Anyway, time will tell on this. We could go back and forth for ages and not get anywhere.

I do know that what JoeRod said in a previous post about the ACCs perception of the Big 12 is true. I'm not saying that it's deserved, but that is how they feel. Several good team/programs have left the Big 12 recently.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

In the previous post you say the performance is nebulous and that the ACC will always be a hoops conference.

Then you proceed to take a very narrow snapshot of performance and try to make that relevant. Everyone knows the ACC has been down recently. But I don't think anyone feels that that this tiny window of time is a permanant thing.

The data is either important or it isn't...can't have it both ways ABQ.

For example, as you stated, Florida State has not really been all that good since 2006...as if they won't be a super power again real soon.
Well, the last two years they've had crazy good recruiting classes and Jimbo Fisher has them heading toward powerhouse status again.

Anyway, time will tell on this. We could go back and forth for ages and not get anywhere.

I do know that what JoeRod said in a previous post about the ACCs perception of the Big 12 is true. I'm not saying that it's deserved, but that is how they feel. Several good team/programs have left the Big 12 recently.

Actually, I think I said that I believe FSU is a program on the rise. I don't think I'm trying to have it both ways here. I went to FSU so I do follow them fairly closely. They are not my first love but I do want them to succeed. They have not been good these past several years and that's pretty much a fact. You just need to look at there record and I think it makes it's own statement. I would love FSU to come join the Big 12. If they don't, then they don't but the real issue here from my point of view is that leaving the ACC is coming from the FSU side. It's not something that somebody else is carrying the flag on.

How far back do you think we should go with the ACC? I think 6 years is plenty. Programs rise and fall in a period of 6 years. That's plenty of time to judge the success of Football Programs in any Conference IMO. I don't think it's unfair but doesn't really matter. Time will tell the tale.

 

[rkell87]

from warchant who is trying to get a FB and twitter campaign started








There is obviously a lot of discussion among our fan base in favor of FSU leaving the ACC, or at least exploring our options. However, sitting around on a message board and complaining about it doesn't get the job done. If you want to effect change, you have to affect the minds of the decision makers. If you will think back to a year or so ago, the decision makers at both Texas A&M and Missouri did not want to leave the Big 12. The reason they both ended up leaving the Big 12 is because of outcry from fans and alumni to change their position. Who are the decision makers you might ask? Here is where you can start:


Eric Barron, University President: president@mailer.fsu.edu (850) 644-1085

Andy Haggard, Chairman of the Board of Trustees: WAH@haggardlawfirm.com 305-446-5700

Susie Busch-Transou, Vice-Chairman of the Board of Trustees: stransou@tallbud.com 850-539-2565

Allen Bense, Board of Trustees: agb@gaccontractors.com 850-769-3477

Ed Burr, Board of Trustees: eburr@greenpointellc.com 904-998-8841

Dr. Joe Camps, Board of Trustees: nfabiano@seuc.com 850-309-0400

Emily Fleming Duda, Board of Trustees: tracy@duda.com 407-365-6336

Joe Gruters, Board of Trustees: joegruters@gmail.com 941-747?0500

Mark Hillis, Board of Trustees: markhillis64@yahoo.com 850-524-2035

James Kinsey, Board of Trustees: jkinsey@kinseysells.com 239-939-1367 ext. 200

Sandra Lewis, Board of Trustees: slewis@fsu.edu 850-644-8409

Peggy Rolando, Board of Trustees: mrolando@shutts.com 305-379-9144

Brent Sembler, Board of Trustees: Brent.Sembler@sembler.com 727-544-4244

Rueben Stokes, Board of Trustees: fsusgapresident@admin.fsu.edu 850-644-1811

Randy Spetman, FSU AD: rspetman@admin.fsu.edu (850) 644-1079


Those are your main decision makers at the university folks.

If you want to see FSU in a new conference, you must change the minds of the decision makers. That means you need to email and call all of them and express your opinion. Do so respectfully. Let them know that you support FSU and want what is best for it. Do not threaten to withhold money from the university if we do not switch conferences, but if you do give money to the university, let them know. Oh and it can't stop with just you. You must email and call everyone of your friends who are Noles and convince them to do the same. Use social media, whether it be Facebook or Twitter and let the world know how you feel about what FSU is doing and where we should do.

I am not personally advocating staying in the ACC or leaving at this point. However, I know there are many of you who feel passionately on this subject. If you feel passionately about this subject, you have the ability to effect real change at your university. Don't just sit around and talk about it on Warchant, but empower your fellow Noles and the decision makers who matter to understand your point of view. That doesn't mean you will necessarily get your way. However, if you want change to happen, you need to step up and take charge. ~ DemocraticNole

 

[DFWJC]

Six years is nowhere near long enough to establish how good a program is, imo. It only says how good a team has been for a 6 years..nothing really. 20-30 years maybe.

It doest matter anyway...no big deal.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Six years is nowhere near long enough to establish how good a program is, imo. It only says how good a team has been for a 6 years..nothing really. 20-30 years maybe.

It doest matter anyway...no big deal.

Your opinion I suppose. Me, if within 6 years, a program has not shown significant improvement, I'm looking for changes. That could be coaching or it could be conference changes. You could continue to wait but if you do and circumstance change significantly, as in, a new playoff system with a new conference alignment with four newly formed super conferences, for example, you could find yourself on the outside looking in if you are not in the right position to take advantage of that.

I think it is less then responsible to just do nothing. You must understand what options you have and act upon them for the good of the University.

While I think it was foolish for TAMU to head to the SEC, I am sure that they did it because they felt like it was in the best interests of the University long term. Would be the same line of thought for FSU IMO.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

There is obviously a lot of discussion among our fan base in favor of FSU leaving the ACC, or at least exploring our options. However, sitting around on a message board and complaining about it doesn't get the job done. If you want to effect change, you have to affect the minds of the decision makers. If you will think back to a year or so ago, the decision makers at both Texas A&M and Missouri did not want to leave the Big 12. The reason they both ended up leaving the Big 12 is because of outcry from fans and alumni to change their position. Who are the decision makers you might ask? Here is where you can start:

Actually, I'm pretty sure that they both did. Both had ample opportunity to stay and both opted to leave.

 

[rkell87]

Actually, I'm pretty sure that they both did. Both had ample opportunity to stay and both opted to leave.

that is what I thought but it was a copy paste job, not my opinion.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Concerning Louisville I have heard the following...

Jurich has privately given the Big East their notice. BE brass want it kept under wraps for a bit due to concern of conference falling apart

Also read the following concerning clemson...

On the advice of Clemson's Athletic Advisory Committee, Dr Terry Phillips has requested the ACC for a detailed outline of everything they would need to do if they ever decided to exit the conference.

We already know Louisville wants out of the Big East and they wanted to get into the Big 12. Now follow up this with the Clemson info it seems clemson has at the very least thought of leaving the ACC.

 

[DFWJC]

Concerning Louisville I have heard the following...

Jurich has privately given the Big East their notice. BE brass want it kept under wraps for a bit due to concern of conference falling apart

Also read the following concerning clemson...

On the advice of Clemson's Athletic Advisory Committee, Dr Terry Phillips has requested the ACC for a detailed outline of everything they would need to do if they ever decided to exit the conference.

We already know Louisville wants out of the Big East and they wanted to get into the Big 12. Now follow up this with the Clemson info it seems Clemson has at the very least thought of leaving the ACC.

At this rate, the remaining Big East will be more like CUSA. Actually, I guess Louisville was also ex-CUSA.
Louisville makes sense to me--especially given that WVU is already in the Big 12. The Big 12 would be a huge upgrade.
BTW, the Big 12 would be pretty strong in hoops if this happens: Kansas, Lousiville, WVU, Texas....not bad.

 

[rkell87]

At this rate, the remaining Big East will be more like CUSA. Actually, I guess Lousville was also ex-CUSA.
Louisville makes sense to me--especially given that WVU is already in the Big 12. The Big 12 would be a huge upgrade.
BTW, the Big 12 would be pretty strong in hoops is this happens: Kansas, Lousiville, WVU, Texas....not bad.

baylor has been solid as of late as well

 

[DFWJC]

baylor has been solid as of late as well

Oh yeah, and the athletic program overall has been amazing.

OKie St has its moments too.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

that is what I thought but it was a copy paste job, not my opinion.

Yeah, I remember discussing that at the time and I do recall you feeling like that as well. It's a copy and paste job.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

http://texas.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1363940

This is what's really pushing the realignment issue, along with the advent of a playoff system IMO.

The Seminoles are in one of the few states - with a population of 19 million - in which a university could turn its third-tier rights into the school's own television network the way Texas has done in the Lone Star State (population 25.6 million).

TOO GOOD TO PASS UP?: One industry source said if Texas can command $300 million over 20 years - $15 million per year in additional TV revenue - for its own network, Florida State should be able to command at least a third that much ($5 million), if not more, in a state with so many television sets and a passion for FSU sports.

If what we have heard is true, in that the payout on the new contract with the ACC is really 16 Million, as opposed to 17 and the annual payout in the Big 12 is 20 plus an additional 5 million from 3rd tier rights, what we are really talking about is an increase, over 2011, of 12 million a season. That's 8 million more then the projected best offer from the ACC. That's a big difference in payout.


I recommend you read the entire article. To do so, click on this link:
http://texas.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1363940

 

[MC KAos]

i heard today that Boise St. is reconsidering their move to the big east and might stay in the MWC! it could be just because of the new playoff system, it could be because the big east is truly about to fall apart!

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

i heard today that Boise St. is reconsidering their move to the big east and might stay in the MWC! it could be just because of the new playoff system, it could be because the big east is truly about to fall apart!

There has been talk of this for a few months now. Because of the possibility of a merge between the MWC and CUSA to form a big super conference, the fact that the Big East has not only lost WV and TCU but also Pitt and Syracuse now and lastly, the instability issues of the WAC (Boise St would only be joining the Big East for football, all other sports in the WAC) Boise St might just decide against the move.

I would not be at all surprised to see them go to the MWC. I would love still to see them join the Big 12. That would truly be a great addition to the Northern Division of the Big 12.

 

[DFWJC]

i heard today that Boise St. is reconsidering their move to the big east and might stay in the MWC! it could be just because of the new playoff system, it could be because the big east is truly about to fall apart!

I don't blame them.
That crappy BCS format had programs like BSU scurrying around trying to at least get in a "BCS" conference. They have no business being inthe Big East.

And like ABQ said, the Big East has lost 4 very strong members just in the past few months and added the likes of SMU--which has never even won CUSA.