Wow, Refs Handed Game To Pats

[tyke1doe]

Again, it's analogous reasoning.

The point of my Gaffney/Owens comparison is elucidating a possible disparity in the manner in which games and certain teams are called.

Officiating in pro sports is a largely subjective endeavor. One can make arguments for holding, illegal contact, or PI on every play.

By my understanding of the previous article, the Ravens' players are not asking for absolute accuracy from officials; they merely want uniformity and consistency amongst calls. Put simply, they want an evenly officiated game.

Of course, none of us can prove the existence of a bias in officiating anymore than you can disprove it.

I simply find it convenient that, on every crucial play during the Pats' game winning drive (2 fourth down conversions and a TD pass), there was a questionable act of officiating, either a flag or a booth review, that somehow benefited the Patriots.

Gaffney's bobble certainly qualifies. Steve Young commented on the illegal motion penalty against the Patriots' lineman that nullified another Ravens 4th down stop. According to Young, when a motion occurs so close to the play, it will normally go uncalled.

Not tonight, however.

That's all fine and dandy. But you're comparing apples with oranges.

I can buy your argument that the calls should be consistent WITHIN GAME.

But your response was that the next time you see T.O. bobble a ball and it ruled a non-catch, you're going to reference the Gaffney call. The officiating crews will be different as will the situation.

Nevertheless, I understand your point. That was a good post.

 

[tyke1doe]

You should go to sleep cuz you got knocked the **** out in this thread.


http://img149.*************/img149/8112/christuckeriu7.jpg

Would that be a "biased" opinion?

Oh, and nothing underscores the "proof" of one's argument than a well-placed image.

 

[tyke1doe]

BS. It wasn't even close to questionable. And, again, the ref could NOT see the defender cuz Austin was right between them, BLOCKING HIS VIEW of the defender.


Is that too difficult for you to comprehend?


Not only that, but the defender reached out and grabbed with his left hand THEN his right hand, even w/o the "tripping" it's pass interference. It's not even debatable to anyone that could actually SEE the play.

LOL!

I see. Penalties which favor the Cowboys even though the flag comes out late: not debatable.

Penalties which favor the Pats and allow them to continue their quest for perfect: debatable.

 

[InmanRoshi]

I went to bed at halftime knowing the Patriots would win but not cover.

When Thomas tried to behead Boller and no flag was thrown I knew the fix was in.


The NFL will do everything in its power to insure that the Patriots are 15-0 going into their final game against the Giants on the NFLN. A 14-1 team playing backups might upset a few people in the Boston area who won't get the game but a team going for perfection (and millions upon millions wanting to root against them) is going to be a bonanza for the NFL in their battle versus Comcast, Time Warner and others.

I don't think the average fan understands how many hundreds of millions of dollars are being fought over.

Ah yes, the ubiquitous "nobody else understands the game like I understand the game" from Spadowski. Last time I heard this, it was in regards to "anyone who criticizes Roy Williams in coverage is the reason other fans make fun of Cowboy fans". Of course, the following week Wade made Roy a part time player.

If the NFL has the fix in for New England they sure have a funny way of showing it, considering the 3 absolutely horrendous PI calls in the Colts game. No call is as subjective and can change the game like PI. Also, awfully risky of the refs to wait until the final moments to "fix" the game.

 

[tyke1doe]

Gotta love someone who runs there mouth but does'nt even know the rules of football.

Gotta love someone who interprets typing as one running one's mouth.

 

[tyke1doe]

Rack, you do know who you are addressing in your post, right? :laugh2:

Yes, tell him who he's addressing, please.

I'm sure someone is going to say I'm a Patriots homer in disguise. :laugh2:

 

[tyke1doe]

Ah yes, the ubiquitous "nobody else understands the game like I understand the game" from Spadowski. Last time I heard this, it was in regards to "anyone who criticizes Roy Williams in coverage is the reason other fans make fun of Cowboy fans". Of course, the following week Wade made Roy a part time player.

If the NFL has the fix in for New England they sure have a funny way of showing it, considering the 3 absolutely horrendous PI calls in the Colts game. No call is as subjective and can change the game like PI. Also, awfully risky of the refs to wait until the final moments to "fix" the game.

 

[InmanRoshi]

GOtta wonder at the so called Cowboys fans who are so dedicated at defending the Pats.

The Patriots aren't a Cowboys rival. We have no history with the Patriots. They aren't in our division, our conference and therefore have no impact on our playoff future. I heard people say they were cheering for the Eagles over the Patriots last week. I heard people say they were cheering for the Commanders over the Patriots when the division was still in doubt ... those are the people who I wonder about Cowboy allegiance. I wonder if some peole hate the Patriots more than they love the Cowboys.

In today's NFL when 13 out of the 16 weekly matchups are absolutely unwatchable, it's rare to see good football and the Patriots play good football more than anyone in the NFL. I don't cheer for the Patriots, I cheer for good football.

 

[zrinkill]

The refs did not screw the Ravens ..... the Ravens coaching staff and the players who lost their composure at the end of the game did.

 

[StanleySpadowski]

Fair enough.

I'm just taking exception to these claims that the refs are trying to give the game to the Patriots.

The hold on Watson could have gone either way. But it wasn't a bad call. The player had his hand on Watson and impeded his path to the ball.

On the Gaffney play, the ref saw that he caught the ball with his finger tips then brought it into his body. He ruled it a catch and the replay booth agreed.

Refs are human. Yes, they make bad calls. Yes, they make questionable call.

But fans have to understand that the Patriots are no different than the Cowboys of the 90s, the 49ers of the 80s and the Steelers of the 70s. Great teams get calls like that and win their share of the questionable calls.

Complain, be upset, be angry. But unless you (not "you" specific but "you" in general) can prove they are trying to "fix" a game, it's merely wild speculation. Nothing more.

Could even the most biased officiating "fix" every game? No. But they can heavily influence the outcome of close games.

The holding call late was a foul within the letter of the rules however, it wasn't called all game and in the opinion of most, it wouldn't have been called against the Patriots.

I just finished watching the game and can honestly say that I feel the officiating was one-sided. One-sided enough that it influenced the outcome.

Two plays that really stood out to me were when Thomas went to Boller's head. Boller avoided the sack then completed a long pass. You can clearly see an official reach for his flag then change his mind so he definitely saw it. The other was the last play of the game. It seemed as though the official saw a PI on the Ravens (probably rightfully so) and was waiting to see if the Ravens scored before he needed to throw the flag.

 

[fanfromvirginia]

What does T.O. have to do with that catch?

Yes, he did catch the ball. I watched it on Tivo and watch the slow-mo of the catch. He catches the ball by the tip of his fingers and then switches it after he goes out of bounds.

But I can understand why you're upset. You're comparing it to a non-call on T.O.

He either caught it or he came close enough as to be inconclusive.

 

[theogt]

Uh, because the ref closest to the play doesn't throw the flag. A ref farther from the play throws the flag, and that several seconds after the play was over.

Uh, because Bigby incidentially touches Austin and tangles feet with the receiver, which isn't suppose to be a pass interference.

I mean, I'll take the penalty, but I thought it was a questionable call, especially since the flag didn't come out immediately.

Apparently you don't know what pass interference is.

It only matters that the feet tangling is incidental if the player is going for the ball. The player never even turned and looked for the ball.

I can see why you're arguing. You don't know the rules or what happened on the field.

 

[theogt]

He either caught it or he came close enough as to be inconclusive.

Go back and watch the TO catch that was reversed in the 3rd quarter (2:00 minute mark) of the Green Bay game. It's basically the same thing. The ball was in his hands, but it was moving when he had both feet down.

The refs overturned it on Owens and it was the right call. This call should have been overturned as well.

 

[fanfromvirginia]

Go back and watch the TO catch that was reversed in the 3rd quarter (2:00 minute mark) of the Green Bay game. It's basically the same thing. The ball was in his hands, but it was moving when he had both feet down.

The refs overturned it on Owens and it was the right call. This call should have been overturned as well.

Assuming you're right (for the sake of argument), what has been proven? That refs aren't consistent? Well, okay, I'm sold on that argument. That refs are out to get the Cowboys? Eh, we're a pretty biased lot in here; although I suppose it could be true this isn't nearly enough to convince me. That the Pats game was fixed? Uh...no, hell no.

 

[burmafrd]

Its obscene with so much money in the NFL they cannot have full time refs.

 

[ScipioCowboy]

That's all fine and dandy. But you're comparing apples with oranges.

I can buy your argument that the calls should be consistent WITHIN GAME.

But your response was that the next time you see T.O. bobble a ball and it ruled a non-catch, you're going to reference the Gaffney call. The officiating crews will be different as will the situation.

Nevertheless, I understand your point. That was a good post.

I'm hardly comparing apples with oranges. A comparison between two different players is perfectly valid when one team seems to receive beneficial calls from different officiating crews.

Furthermore, I think it's important that league officials maintain some level of consistency between crews. The Ravens players said as much.

 

[theogt]

Assuming you're right (for the sake of argument), what has been proven? That refs aren't consistent? Well, okay, I'm sold on that argument. That refs are out to get the Cowboys? Eh, we're a pretty biased lot in here; although I suppose it could be true this isn't nearly enough to convince me. That the Pats game was fixed? Uh...no, hell no.

Did you assume that any conversation on this board had any bearing on anything?

 

[JohnnyHopkins]

I'm hardly comparing apples with oranges. A comparison between two different players is perfectly valid when one team seems to receive beneficial calls from different officiating crews.

Furthermore, I think it's important that league officials maintain some level of consistency between crews. The Ravens players said as much.

Totally agree with the consistency issue, but that is the fault of the league, not the Refs. Remember that these officials are on a part time basis and have full time jobs outside of football. I doubt that leaves a great amount of time to keep all Crews in line with a certain mindset. Until the NFL stops being cheap about this and has full time refs that are dedicated solely to calling these games, they will always have glaring inconsistencies in the way things are called.

 

[dbair1967]

But they did. They made the plays when they had to. And the stupid Ravens couldn't close out the game. All they need to do is make ONE third down conversion on any one of their three series - the last series not included.
They did not.

And so what if the Pats don't blow every team out. They're winning. You seem to be angry because they're getting hyped for destroying teams. So they squeak by with a win. Last time I checked, it's still a win.

I dont care if they win every game by 3 pts, that has nothing to do with my point

what I dont like is seeing games blatantly affected by one sided officiating...it was pathetic, and their games all seem to be pretty one sided...I dont follow the Ravens on a day to day basis, but I cant recall one time where they've publicly complained about officiating...and it wasnt like the game cost them a shot at the playoffs either, they werent going win or lose...they were mad (and rightfully) because the Pats got a ton of help from the zebras to win

David

 

[dbair1967]

Its obscene with so much money in the NFL they cannot have full time refs.

its even more obscene that you see the same crews offer up week after week of poor officiating too...the bad refs/crews should be punished, pay docked or fired

David