Walking Dead Season 7 **merged**

[TellerMorrow34]

I think they need something different than what feels like 'The Governor Part 2' all over again, only this time done worse.

And that's not a knock on Jeffrey Dean Morgan, it's a knock on poor writing of a shallow, unbelievable character.

I'm sorry but I disagree to some extent.

The show did a great job with the Governor and that can't be denied. But that was because they basically turned him away from kind of how he was in the graphic novel.

In the graphic novel he starts out as completely insane, cuts off Ricks hand the first time he meets him, rapes Michionne repeatedly, and is just an all around terrible, awful, vile person right from the get go.

In the TV show that's not exactly how they portrayed him. They portrayed him as a leader with a decent heart who had a bit of a dark side and secret that was exposed completely when Michionne killed his daughter.


The TV version of Negan is pretty much spot on with the graphic novel of him. The dialogue is almost identical, the way Morgan plays him is pretty much the way he is. He's a smooth talker whose always talking smack and is able to lead a large group of people simply by being able to talk folks into following him.

I would imagine the TV show will eventually give you his back story, in the way the graphic novel has as well, and people will find that he's not some sick, twisted, terrible person. He's a flawed but decent man with a terrible start to the apocalypse like everyone else has had.

He found his way to survive in the world by eventually building up The Saviors. Others chose different paths to get to where they're at.


So to be fair to the writers of the show I don't believe they should be trashed for the writing since they're basically taking him right out or the graphic novel, which I am assuming they're doing because he's such a popular part of the graphic novel that they're using him the way he is in that novel.

It is quite unbelievable that he's able to do what he does, and how he survives going forward and everything, I'll grant you that, but this is a show about a zombie apocalypse for goodness sakes. Everyone should simply expect a large portion of the stories to be unbelievable.

 

[TellerMorrow34]

Agreed that the TV version of "The Governor" was done much better than the TV version of Negan.

I don't think we're too far off from a big arc turn.

I would imagine the rest of this season plays out with Rick vs. Negan and The Saviors. I have a feeling that the season ends with All out War, which will be where they obviously fight Negan in an all out war to survive.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I would imagine the rest of this season plays out with Rick vs. Negan and The Saviors. I have a feeling that the season ends with All out War, which will be where they obviously fight Negan in an all out war to survive.

Agreed on the season ending with AOW.

 

[maxdogg]

I only read the first compendium of the comics so I don't know anything after the governor but in all out war aren't the whisperers involved?
Also I agree the tv show did a much better job with the governor.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I only read the first compendium of the comics so I don't know anything after the governor but in all out war aren't the whisperers involved?
Also I agree the tv show did a much better job with the governor.

The next group challenge is a ways a way... Lot's of things to go down between now and then.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

Both of you make great points. I feel like maybe I'm some what clouded in what I see from Negan because as a fan of the graphic novel I know his back story already and how he acts at other points in the graphic novel so I feel like maybe I give him a pass as more of a softer guy then people realize.

Which, to be honest, even with all that other information from the graphic novels he could just be very manipulative but I don't feel like that's really who he is at his core.

Negan sees something (killer/serial killer)in carl. He likes what he sees.

He probably wants Carl to replace scarface... not Daryl.

 

[TellerMorrow34]

I only read the first compendium of the comics so I don't know anything after the governor but in all out war aren't the whisperers involved?
Also I agree the tv show did a much better job with the governor.

No.

They come much later.

 

[TellerMorrow34]

Negan sees something (killer/serial killer)in carl. He likes what he sees.

He probably wants Carl to replace scarface... not Daryl.

I am not sure if it's about having him replace Dwight, to be honest. It could be, although that's not really examined all that much in the graphic novel.

But you have to remember that in the graphic novel Carl is also like 10 or 11 at this point, at best. He's a child. Negan's respect for him in the comic is simply do to the fact that he's absolutely not afraid.

Which is what they're transferring over to the TV show. Carl has shown guts, and bravery, in even attempting what he's attempted. It's something that Negan finds fascinating. It's also, IMO, a big part of why he didn't kill Daryl. He has found some level of respect, even if it isn't exactly obvious, in Daryl being willing to risk himself the way he did to punch him.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

I am not sure if it's about having him replace Dwight, to be honest. It could be, although that's not really examined all that much in the graphic novel.

But you have to remember that in the graphic novel Carl is also like 10 or 11 at this point, at best. He's a child. Negan's respect for him in the comic is simply do to the fact that he's absolutely not afraid.

Which is what they're transferring over to the TV show. Carl has shown guts, and bravery, in even attempting what he's attempted. It's something that Negan finds fascinating. It's also, IMO, a big part of why he didn't kill Daryl. He has found some level of respect, even if it isn't exactly obvious, in Daryl being willing to risk himself the way he did to punch him.

Looking for a good Negan soldier then?
Or simply just airtime for these two? I have to believe he has plans for Him? That's twice Carl's pulled a gun on him.

 

[Stash]

Agreed that the TV version of "The Governor" was done much better than the TV version of Negan.

I don't think we're too far off from a big arc turn.

I hope so. I don't know how long this storyline played out in the comics, but I don't think the TV audience will wait for an entire season for what we know will happen to play out.

 

[Stash]

I'm sorry but I disagree to some extent.

The show did a great job with the Governor and that can't be denied. But that was because they basically turned him away from kind of how he was in the graphic novel.

In the graphic novel he starts out as completely insane, cuts off Ricks hand the first time he meets him, rapes Michionne repeatedly, and is just an all around terrible, awful, vile person right from the get go.

In the TV show that's not exactly how they portrayed him. They portrayed him as a leader with a decent heart who had a bit of a dark side and secret that was exposed completely when Michionne killed his daughter.

Sounds like I agree with you, the TV version of the Governor was better. At least the audience knew something about the character and his motivations. Same can't be said for Negan.

The TV version of Negan is pretty much spot on with the graphic novel of him. The dialogue is almost identical, the way Morgan plays him is pretty much the way he is. He's a smooth talker whose always talking smack and is able to lead a large group of people simply by being able to talk folks into following him.

I would imagine the TV show will eventually give you his back story, in the way the graphic novel has as well, and people will find that he's not some sick, twisted, terrible person. He's a flawed but decent man with a terrible start to the apocalypse like everyone else has had.

He found his way to survive in the world by eventually building up The Saviors. Others chose different paths to get to where they're at.


So to be fair to the writers of the show I don't believe they should be trashed for the writing since they're basically taking him right out or the graphic novel, which I am assuming they're doing because he's such a popular part of the graphic novel that they're using him the way he is in that novel.

Then I think they should follow the same instincts they had with the Governor, because what we're getting isn't working for me, and a great many other fans as the huge ratings drop is showing.

It is quite unbelievable that he's able to do what he does, and how he survives going forward and everything, I'll grant you that, but this is a show about a zombie apocalypse for goodness sakes. Everyone should simply expect a large portion of the stories to be unbelievable.

As I've said, I'm willing to suspend a great deal of disbelief, but this storyline has crossed over into insulting the audience's intelligence as far as I'm concerned. It's becoming tough to stick with it.

 

[MileyDancer]

I would imagine the rest of this season plays out with Rick vs. Negan and The Saviors. I have a feeling that the season ends with All out War, which will be where they obviously fight Negan in an all out war to survive.

So, they same as half the other seasons

 

[TellerMorrow34]

Looking for a good Negan soldier then?
Or simply just airtime for these two? I have to believe he has plans for Him? That's twice Carl's pulled a gun on him.

I believe it's air time that builds up Carl further toward possibly being an eventual leader. And depending on what the show is going with (If it's going it's own path or following the graphic novel) I feel that it's simply that Negan respects, and to some weird extent, is fascinated by the fact that Carl will stand up to him.

 

[TellerMorrow34]

Sounds like I agree with you, the TV version of the Governor was better. At least the audience knew something about the character and his motivations. Same can't be said for Negan.



Then I think they should follow the same instincts they had with the Governor, because what we're getting isn't working for me, and a great many other fans as the huge ratings drop is showing.



As I've said, I'm willing to suspend a great deal of disbelief, but this storyline has crossed over into insulting the audience's intelligence as far as I'm concerned. It's becoming tough to stick with it.

All fair points.

I love this character in the graphic novel and I've been pleased they haven't changed him. I realized, even while reading the novel, that there is simply no way a guy could do what he's doing and survive. There are just too many reasons that people simply wouldn't allow his Saviors to take them over like they have. But that's just part of the reading and the show, for me anyway.


I think when they show the backstory to Negan, which I believe they very likely will, it will change a lot of opinion on him. That's just my feeling though. I could be wrong.

I think there is just as good a chance that taking the risk of keeping him the way he was in the graphic novel, for the fans of the novel, will bite them in the butt with the TV fans who simply do not care for him, or his style, the way the comic fans do.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

I believe it's air time that builds up Carl further toward possibly being an eventual leader. And depending on what the show is going with (If it's going it's own path or following the graphic novel) I feel that it's simply that Negan respects, and to some weird extent, is fascinated by the fact that Carl will stand up to him.

Good read.

A possibility for sure.

 

[TellerMorrow34]

So, they same as half the other seasons

Ehhh yes and no.

This is a much larger battle, or should I say series of battles, with Negan then what they've had before. The stuff with the Gov. was kind of really just one actual fight. His last attack was really the only one that was a real attack. The first 'attack' was easily thwarted because the Governor arrogantly assumed they were unable to defend themselves.

The three battles with Negan (If they go that route) are different. Especially the last two which are actual battles with lives lost and a real show down between the main good guy and main bad guy that the Governor arc missed out on (IMO) in both the graphic novel and the TV show.

 

[Stash]

All fair points.

I love this character in the graphic novel and I've been pleased they haven't changed him. I realized, even while reading the novel, that there is simply no way a guy could do what he's doing and survive. There are just too many reasons that people simply wouldn't allow his Saviors to take them over like they have. But that's just part of the reading and the show, for me anyway.

And I think that it's that ridiculousness that's turning a lot of fan stuff like me off (or away). But I'm glad to hear that someone is enjoying it anyway.

I think when they show the backstory to Negan, which I believe they very likely will, it will change a lot of opinion on him. That's just my feeling though. I could be wrong.

I think there is just as good a chance that taking the risk of keeping him the way he was in the graphic novel, for the fans of the novel, will bite them in the butt with the TV fans who simply do not care for him, or his style, the way the comic fans do.

Ratings seem to be indicating that's the case.

And I'm honestly concerned that those running the show didn't account for this fact in their long term planning and may be unwilling or unable to make any radical changes to their previous plans and pace.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

I believe it's air time that builds up Carl further toward possibly being an eventual leader. And depending on what the show is going with (If it's going it's own path or following the graphic novel) I feel that it's simply that Negan respects, and to some weird extent, is fascinated by the fact that Carl will stand up to him.

To add: Negan knows that he can't live forever.. trying to groom for future of mankind.

 

[TellerMorrow34]

And I think that it's that ridiculousness that's turning a lot of fan stuff like me off (or away). But I'm glad to hear that someone is enjoying it anyway.




Ratings seem to be indicating that's the case.

And I'm honestly concerned that those running the show didn't account for this fact in their long term planning and may be unwilling or unable to make any radical changes to their previous plans and pace.

It is entirely possible that they didn't factor in the that the TV audience wouldn't be into the character the way the graphic novel fans are. I would say that the way he's being portrayed, and with the lines being many times almost exactly word for word out of the graphic novel that you're likely right here that they didn't factor that in and, to this point, are not willing to change from it.

I hate that anyone isn't liking the character though. I'll say this is absolutely my favorite arc from the graphic novel and I was so looking forward to this entire story and build up and fall out. I hate that there is anyone who doesn't enjoy it but I can certainly understand why they do not.

 

[TellerMorrow34]

To add: Negan knows that he can't live forever.. trying to groom for future of mankind.

Excellent point and I definitely do believe you could be right on with that to a large degree. Especially with how the characters interact later on down the line, and how he interacts with Rick, and just some of the back story you get then you realize that he's got a certain mindset about himself and his situation.

Great point man.